Episode 409: 🌴🖍️ Progress over Perfection in the Digital Age 🖍️🌴

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Welcome everyone to another episode of Dynamics Corner.

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What is a marketing strategy, or even an SEO?

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I'm your co-host, chris.

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And this is Brad.

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This episode was recorded on February 19th 2025.

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Chris, Chris, Chris, Marketing.

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I think marketing is one of those undervalued, underrated things that everybody needs, and today we had the opportunity to learn a lot about marketing, marketing strategies and even some tips and tricks how to market a podcast With us.

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Today we had the opportunity to speak with Tara and Brandi from Big Room.

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Clatter, clatter, clatter, clatter.

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Who's typing?

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Me Are you working?

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You working, yes, very hard.

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I can tell I don't know what you?

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what were you typing?

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I was typing to brandy that I'm drinking lemon water in my progress over perfection mug and what's the significance of that.

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The progress over perfection.

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Mug Brandy got me, I got them for all of us.

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Yeah, you did get one for all of us, that's right.

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So we could just you didn't get me one.

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I was going to say define us Where's mine.

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I mean, is that a thing you struggle with?

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Maybe I can get some more.

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There's people that I know struggles with that.

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Yes, progress over perfection.

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I do like that we could talk.

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That is a discussion on its own, in my opinion.

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I can go get my progress over perfection mug and we can both have them going.

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If you send me one, I'll drink it in front of that person that wants to be perfect that wants to be perfect.

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We do love our progress over perfection.

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Reminders.

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That's a good phrase, by the way, because a lot of people want to perfect something and then you'll never get it running.

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I don't think perfection is attainable?

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No, because you'll always find something else right, and that's why, if you try to define that you like something or you don't have strict rules or guides for it, someone can always look at something.

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Oh, one more thing.

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Oh, one more thing.

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The infamous scope creep, and you just have to that's like marketing, right, like marketing is just like that.

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You everyone wants you to be perfect, but I'll never get perfect.

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Well, it's always improvements.

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So exactly perfection.

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Are we going?

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oh, see this.

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We could turn this into a philosophical discussion, if you'd like this is where tara and I are slightly different, because I'm just like ship it and see what happens, and she would like it to be perfect.

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But as you pointed out, br, there is really no attaining perfection, so there isn't.

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So you're saying Tara is like perfectionist, so you like got her a mug to remind her.

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Define herself as a perfectionist.

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I just like remind her that sometimes, when I'm being chaotic and just shipping things before she feels like we should do that, that I'm on the progress over perfection side of the coin and she can sometimes be closer to the perfection side.

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I think, to clarify, I think that the progress over perfection and I think, brandy, to your point of just shipping it I'm on the lines with you because I do like things to be perfect in a sense, according to my level of perfection, but I found that sometimes that's more of a hindrance than a help.

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So I believe in getting something out there that's functional and usable, whatever that may be, and then seeing what falls into play with it, because sometimes you can spend a lot of time on something and it's not adopted, not used, not used, not reached or it's changed, and then you feel like you perfected it.

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But then correct, but I'm not saying just to throw stuff out there and see what sticks.

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So there does have to be some level of completeness to it.

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But you're not going to get everything perfect because, as I had mentioned and I see this every single day it doesn't matter how many times you look at something.

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Every time you look at it again you'll find something that you'd like to change, or somebody will find something they like to change and to be clear.

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If perfection was an option, that would be my 100 goal in life at all times.

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But it just it gets in my real life hey right.

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So at some point, just for my own mental health, I had to accept that, that maybe I'm never gonna get everyone's everything all right the first time you said another key statement see, we're going to be best friends after this taris quiet because I, I've learned like you is you're not best friend quite yet I'm not best friend.

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You gotta work.

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You gotta work on you gotta work on it, you gotta work at it, but you hit the.

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You did hit.

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A key point is yes, things will change, somebody will look at it and you have to get it out.

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If it was achie, achievable or attainable, then we'd all strive for it, but unfortunately I don't believe there is such a thing as perfection.

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If I was an accountant, it would probably cause me more concern to be perfect because I can ruin lives.

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Well, that's concrete, because I think even in there define perfect, the numbers have to add up.

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You may not like the numbers and you can have the numbers in different places, but as long as the numbers add up, it still may not be a perfect balance sheet.

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It may not be a perfect income statement, because you want more revenue, but ultimately you put the income statement of balance sheet together.

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So I don't think perfection is achievable anywhere and I'm just going to lay it down.

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But I do agree with a lot of things that you said.

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I didn't know we had some similarities.

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It scares me in a way, but that's okay.

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I also think that it happens.

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I mean, we see it happen a lot, especially in products and in marketing, right, where people are trying to guess what that last 20% well, what if they want this, or what if we did this?

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And then they're trying to guess what that last 20% well, what if they want this or what if we did this or what?

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And then they're trying to put that in for something perfect, and then you'll spend 80% of your efforts on 20% of the output.

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That may or may not matter, right?

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And so it's better to and again, my mug always reminds me to you know refine what is going to matter, and then you know 80-20 rule.

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Yeah, what happens?

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And then you can better adjust after you've gotten feedback.

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That was perfect what you just said.

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So you achieved perfection in this conversation.

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But it is true, you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all the people all of the time.

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So, even if the point when you do deliver some and I'm talking universally there isn't, I'm not talking.

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I do have some questions, a lot of questions on marketing from you.

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But it could be marketing, it could be a software product, it could be a vehicle, it could be a pen, it could be a table, it could be anything be a software product, it could be a vehicle, it could be a pen, it could be a table, it could be anything.

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Somebody will always find something different.

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Or what, if you know what?

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If it's raining on Tuesday and the power goes out and the wind is high, what will we do then?

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Well, sometimes you have to say, well, we just will deal with it if it happens, and you know it's, or we'll just let it go because that's not that important to us.

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So you have to be able to cut some of that stuff off and realize that there is a target market that you want to reach in the case of marketing.

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But before we jump into the topic and I've been dying to have this conversation, so be ready well, I thought we were best friends already, so now that I know I'd say now she's stuck with that.

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She's gonna be stuck the whole entire time no, I'm gonna work on making him my best friend.

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See, see, Chris, you see what I did there.

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Now she's going to work on trying to be perfect.

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So she was working on progress, but now she's trying to be perfect, a perfect best friend.

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If I work on trying to be perfect, this will all go sideways.

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So I we don't want anyone to try to do anything, but before we jump into the conversation, would you mind telling us a little bit about yourselves and tara?

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You have the mug, so I guess we can start with you.

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we'll say oh man, I was gonna make brandy go first okay, you can go first.

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No, I, because you want to try to be more, you want to try to be a little more perfect than she is.

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She has a perfect response to perfect whatever she we're a little competitive like not usually amongst each other, but a little bit ourselves.

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What do you want to know about me?

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I have been in this channel since the mid 90s, so I'm just going to let all of you do the math on that.

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I have been working.

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I started working in admin, so my one of my first roles was working for one of the larger bars that was selling division that came over from Denmark to Canada or to North America, and so I started working in admin and then I did sales and marketing coordination for that company.

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I vowed that under no circumstances, but I work in technology or continue to do marketing.

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When I got out of university I got a four-year degree in criminology a good old arts degree.

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If you need to know how to bury a body, I can give you some tips.

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And then when I got out of school and couldn't find, you know, a role in my space, because halfway through university decided I didn't want to be a lawyer, which was sort of my track at the time Ended up working for going to a recruitment company, working for them for a bit in sales and marketing coordination and then, when you know what, I ended up back at a marketing company that was focused only on VARs and ISBs, and that was in the early 2000s and so somehow.

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And ISPs, and that was in the early 2000s, and so somehow, despite going to university and working really hard to not be in this space, I am here a solid you know, however, many years later, that that makes me and, yeah, and I actually really do enjoy it, and I think just over the many, many years of being exposed to all of the wonderful and wild people in the software reseller channel, I have absorbed a lot of really great information and learned by osmosis a lot of why the partners and bars and ISPs do what they do and then, on the flip side, what the customers or the prospects are looking for, which I think is a part of what makes our team great.

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Tara will go into her background as well, but everybody here sort of has a long-standing story with the Dynamics channel specifically.

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It's one of those things.

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It's like that ride or that saying I messed up this week, I don't know why, so you'll have to forgive me with it.

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But it's once you enter you cannot leave, because I have known many people over the years that have been in the space, that have left and they come back.

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They get pulled back in they do so it's once you come in, you can't leave there's an invisible magnet there, for sure oh yeah, I believe so, I believe so yeah, absolutely yeah, I'll give you my long winding journey in this channel.

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No, so currently I'm COO and partner at Big Room Creative and you know just a little quick about that.

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I mean, we, we are a boutique marketing agency specifically in the Microsoft dynamic space.

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So so we, we really focus on that, really focus on that.

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However, I started in about 2004 in the channel, so that's a little more specific than Brandy's.

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But you know fun fact a lot of people don't know this I actually started selling Navision when it was Navision, but that lasted only about a year until I moved over to ISV side for a very prominent ISV in the channel and I worked there for over 15 years until I was the VP of marketing there.

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And then they were sold off and in that process I was lucky enough to work with Brandy and Brian and that team because we were augmented marketing, so half was in-house and half was outsourced, and when the company sold we had just worked together so well, brandy and Brian asked me to join.

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Well, brandy and Brian asked me to join, and so it's been about five years now that we've worked together on making marketing magic in the Microsoft world.

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Aiming for progress, huh.

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I like that marketing magic in the Microsoft world.

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So Big Room is a marketing agency in the Microsoft space.

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Do you primarily work with customers, partners, ISVs?

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Who do you work with from the marketing point of view?

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Almost exclusively the partners and the ISVs.

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We don't really have any end user customers.

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We have in the past sort of been exposed to some of the end users and sometimes done some stuff for them.

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But we really focus on helping the bars and the ISVs build their brand identity and differentiate themselves in this market.

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Obviously, on the ISV side it can be a little bit easier to differentiate yourself as the products are a little different.

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But you know, working with some of the bars and everyone selling similar products, that's sort of our sweet spot is helping the brand identify.

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What is it about them that makes a customer want to buy Business Central from them versus, you know, any number of the competition.

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Excellent With the marketing, and this topic has been on my mind for quite a bit and, from hearing the history from both of you, like myself, we've been in this space for quite a bit of time.

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Chris I think we've already determined Chris was in high school or elementary school when I started working with this.

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I don't remember.

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No, we joke.

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I think I was in high school, yeah, like junior or something like that, when you started your career, we'll have to do the math again, but one of the things that I see and one of the challenges that I was hoping that you could help talk with me a little bit about is, as we mature in the space, the we get older.

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As far as we have is working with the product.

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Technology changes.

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You know, in the world.

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We have AI, now we have the internet, whereas when we first started out working with this, the internet didn't exist.

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We use dial up and people made decisions differently.

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So now, as we move forward into 2025, to me, I think, is there a difference in an approach to marketing, to decision makers to go for a product or a service from a partner at ISV?

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That has changed over the years and more in turn is how do you market across generations?

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Because we have a mature industry with Business Central, started with Navision, microsoft Dynamics Nav, but there's also a lot of new companies that are starting to use the application because Business Central is becoming more and more popular.

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What are some challenges or how can some companies deal with marketing across generations?

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A really good question, you know, uh, good timing.

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We actually were just looking at some new research that came out about self-directed buying, right, and that's a really big part of uh.

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There's a couple of things, there's a few different answers to your question, but I think self-directed buying is really at the center of a lot of this, and we were just reading an article about the importance of that and how I think a lot of organizations know okay, you know, buyers, and especially younger buyers, but even buyers throughout, across generations, really do want to collect information and start matching solutions on their own right.

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And is this the partner for me?

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Is this the ERP solution for me?

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Is this the CRM solution for me?

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They don't want to talk to sales representatives all too much before they've made most of their buying decision right.

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And the real key is amongst that educational material and that thought leadership material that you're putting out there to help them self-serve.

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How are you differentiating yourself?

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Because organizations and whether it's software or anything else in the B2B or even really the B2C space, what are you doing differently that might match something that they need?

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Is it a culture fit?

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Is it your you know?

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Your responsiveness, your expertise there's different.

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Is it your, you know technical, the technical team, that you have your availability, your support.

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There's different areas that you have to identify.

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So, first off, you need to meet the buyer where they are.

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You need to meet the customers where they are.

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What are they wanting to learn on their own and are you providing that information?

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And then, within that information, how are you distinguishing, how you're different?

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Right, because that's really.

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Ultimately, it's not even bridging generational gaps anymore.

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They know the tools are at their fingertips to go get what they want and they want to make sure that that information is there.

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So, are you there where they're looking?

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So with the self-directed buying, the buyer now typically does a lot more research, would you say, or they do a lot because of the ease of the internet.

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They can do a lot of searching and research before speaking with you.

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So would it be safe to say that, before they even speak with you, they already have some sort of decision?

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I don't want to say decision you, they already have some sort of decision.

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I don't want to say decision, but they already have some sort of decision or view of who you are and what you have, before they even talked with anybody.

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Yeah, they're not.

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You know, it's an interesting space in marketing because we get data from like search and, like you know, search data and those kinds of things.

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If we look back over, say, the last decade, all of this stuff has been happening the entire time, but the actual people who are selling and some of the buyers themselves, having not gone through the experience, haven't caught up with it.

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But if we go way back to sort of the tendance of SEO in the beginning, how do we get my website to rank?

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We were never going to rank for Microsoft Dynamics 365, business Central, for instance.

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If I want to know about Business Central, I'm going to go to Microsoft's website.

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They're going to publish the most useful technical information for me.

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I know that I, you know, I'm young enough to have gone through university when there was the internet.

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People who are sort of 40 and younger have definitely just grown up assuming that everything is on the other side of the keyboard.

00:20:24.746 --> 00:20:30.364
Right, that's just how they were made to think.

00:20:30.364 --> 00:20:36.546
So, even if you look way back, when we talk about what were some of the ways to get to the top of search engines, it was really about honing in on what are people searching for.

00:20:36.546 --> 00:20:41.882
People do not go to their computer and say I want to buy Dynamics, erp or even ERP.

00:20:41.882 --> 00:20:50.549
Most of the time, if you're talking about ERP, even those people in those research positions have no idea what ERP even is, unless they're trying to replace one they have.

00:20:50.890 --> 00:20:57.275
So they are searching for things like how to get my financials under control or what do I do about my inventory mess in the warehouse.

00:20:57.275 --> 00:20:59.717
Those are the kinds of things that they're looking for.

00:20:59.717 --> 00:21:04.483
So you need to be able to answer that question.

00:21:04.483 --> 00:21:09.493
And it's like the first duck syndrome where, like the first quack, you follow who you know.

00:21:09.493 --> 00:21:15.326
So if I search for that and your website comes up and it's a really great article, I'm giving me a lot.

00:21:15.326 --> 00:21:16.605
You feel my pain.

00:21:16.605 --> 00:21:17.567
My inventory is a mess.

00:21:17.567 --> 00:21:19.929
It's costing me a bunch of money, it's taking a bunch of time.

00:21:19.929 --> 00:21:24.372
Now, when I think about my next question, I might just go right to your website.

00:21:24.372 --> 00:22:01.087
No-transcript read was like the current average is 13 to 15 pieces of content that a buyer will interact with on your website or about your company before they contact you.

00:22:01.087 --> 00:22:07.084
So that could mean attending a webinar, watching a video, your LinkedIn profile downloading a white paper.

00:22:07.484 --> 00:22:08.288
It's increased.

00:22:08.749 --> 00:22:12.644
Yeah, and that is happening constantly, right, because it's right there at the end of your fingertips.

00:22:12.644 --> 00:22:21.508
How that information kind of gets transferred over to decision makers depends on the size of the organization and what that criteria sort of look like.

00:22:21.508 --> 00:22:28.000
But people are not out there looking for a product, they're out there looking to solve a problem.

00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:35.769
So to the degree that you can be the beacon of light in their distressed state, you will be the place that they want to connect with.

00:22:36.779 --> 00:22:45.724
That's a good call out, just talking about problems that you're solving, not necessarily focus on the tools and the software itself.

00:22:45.724 --> 00:23:08.588
It's much more important to put content like hey, this is a problem that we're going to solve and be able to find it because you're right, they're going to look at how do I reconcile a bank statement, and there's tons of tools and softwares that can do that, but you want someone that has the knowledge and and be able to answer that question for you.

00:23:08.588 --> 00:23:23.304
So I think their content is becoming more important and, of course, you get a follow-up with the relationship aspect when they do reach out to you yeah, and it means having content that covers a range, right, and so you need to have that content.

00:23:23.344 --> 00:23:26.082
That's really what we call top of the funnel or tofu content.

00:23:26.082 --> 00:23:28.548
Where that is a person, they have a problem.

00:23:28.548 --> 00:23:30.981
They have no idea if there's even a solution for that.

00:23:30.981 --> 00:23:32.987
That's where you want to meet them.

00:23:32.987 --> 00:23:34.211
You want to meet them there.

00:23:34.211 --> 00:23:38.790
You don't want to meet them when they're looking for Dynamics 365 because they're already bought in.

00:23:38.790 --> 00:23:40.221
They've already talked to somebody.

00:23:40.221 --> 00:23:46.534
They already have a connection with this guy because his support team's great, or this person because the guy that owns the company went to university with me.

00:23:46.534 --> 00:23:48.887
There's a million ways that they get there.

00:23:48.887 --> 00:23:52.351
You want to meet them when they're still trying to figure out if there's a solution.

00:23:52.351 --> 00:24:04.972
And I mean, I think everybody knows there's a technology solution to every problem you could imagine, right, like, obviously the accounting software is going to help your accounting Great, so who cares?

00:24:04.972 --> 00:24:05.192
Right?

00:24:05.192 --> 00:24:06.926
What is the company going to do for me?

00:24:06.926 --> 00:24:10.830
How am I going to get more value out of this than just you plugging software in?

00:24:12.621 --> 00:24:19.980
So it's more to the services and the company and the individuals over the product.

00:24:19.980 --> 00:24:28.474
So, to take it back, it's individuals aren't searching for Dynamics 365 Business Central because they may or may not know it exists.

00:24:28.474 --> 00:24:31.589
And if they do know it exists, they may know they already want it.

00:24:31.589 --> 00:24:35.691
They just need to work with someone who can help them solve their problem the best.

00:24:35.691 --> 00:24:46.721
So, from a marketing perspective, it's having the proper image of where a problem solver we specialize in these types of problems per se Right.

00:24:47.122 --> 00:24:47.963
And not everybody.

00:24:47.963 --> 00:24:53.827
Not every partner or ISP solves the same problem, and so what is the problem that you're the best at solving?

00:24:53.827 --> 00:24:57.262
Let's exploit that to market it to the people who are looking for that right.

00:24:57.262 --> 00:25:07.551
Some people really need a really robust support team because they have a huge accounting department that they're maybe not as skilled and they need to know that they're going to have 24-7 support.

00:25:07.551 --> 00:25:15.565
Other people are like I don't really need the support, I just need someone who I can trust to maintain it and make sure that my software doesn't go down right.

00:25:15.565 --> 00:25:18.901
There's a whole gamut of reasons why people will attach them.

00:25:19.141 --> 00:25:20.182
No, I like it.

00:25:20.182 --> 00:25:29.689
The point that you hit was Microsoft is now spending a lot of time on the documentation of Business Central, as you had mentioned.

00:25:29.689 --> 00:25:39.726
They're doing a great job of explaining what it can do, having white papers of what it can do, adding content to their website, even down to the details of how to do specific functions.

00:25:39.726 --> 00:25:48.393
So, in a sense, as you had mentioned, you're not going to beat that on a website yourself unless you just take all of that same content and put it on yours.

00:25:48.393 --> 00:25:58.315
So it's a matter of being able to differentiate yourself from others that implement the software and then focusing on the things, as you had mentioned, that may make you different.

00:25:58.315 --> 00:26:03.665
So, just to recap, I'm learning, so I just repeat so I can put it in my head.

00:26:03.665 --> 00:26:11.634
So, if you have something like you have multilingual resources or geez, I'm not supposed to say that, chris you have to edit that out.

00:26:11.976 --> 00:26:12.516
I'll get in trouble.

00:26:13.401 --> 00:26:17.692
You have multilingual contributors to your team.

00:26:17.692 --> 00:26:21.991
So if somebody has multiple locations in different countries, that's something that could differentiate you.

00:26:21.991 --> 00:26:23.826
Focus on what makes you different in the services you provide.

00:26:23.826 --> 00:26:24.026
Countries.

00:26:24.026 --> 00:26:25.327
That's something that could differentiate you.

00:26:25.327 --> 00:26:26.990
Focus on what makes you different in the services you provide.

00:26:26.990 --> 00:26:36.923
See, this is great because I see so many that they emphasize and I always bring ERP software and Chris loves to hear me say this to building a house or doing an addition to a house, because it is.

00:26:36.923 --> 00:26:37.506
It's a project.

00:26:37.506 --> 00:26:38.347
You're building something.

00:26:38.347 --> 00:26:42.183
You don't call the carpenter worrying about the hammer that he's going to use.

00:26:42.183 --> 00:26:46.490
You just say a wall put up, or I need a house built, you use the tools.

00:26:46.490 --> 00:26:49.314
So here's the tools that we have to have the house built.

00:26:50.035 --> 00:27:04.186
So I like the materials itself right, like I mean, you could choose whatever materials, but you still want that person that will not only just implement but give you you know the pitfalls and things to look out for and better design.

00:27:04.186 --> 00:27:04.828
You know how do you?

00:27:04.828 --> 00:27:06.863
You know how do you approach this differently.

00:27:07.625 --> 00:27:22.768
That's important than just someone who can just hammer stuff in yeah, I mean, anyone can like put flooring down, but it would be great if the person who was going to do that told you that this is the worst floor you can choose for your dog because they're going to ruin it right, like that's the disconnect.

00:27:22.768 --> 00:27:27.846
Yes, kind of right there, right, anyone can sell you anything, but is it going to work for you?

00:27:29.795 --> 00:27:35.909
Right, and I think this is also you know where we saw this emergence.

00:27:35.909 --> 00:27:46.820
So you know what I'm actually going to create a much longer story about this, going back to my one year, as in the vision sales, I'll never forget.

00:27:46.820 --> 00:27:51.449
I had to create the CD like an actual CD-ROM.

00:27:51.449 --> 00:27:54.714
That was sort of this sales presentation.

00:27:54.714 --> 00:28:05.226
We focused on like kind of like civic organizations, right, maybe municipalities, cities, things like that, counties, cities, things like that counties, and I put together this whole CD-ROM.

00:28:05.226 --> 00:28:26.132
That was like why, right, our organization addressed this and our version of NAV and how we configured you know what I shouldn't even say now, because it was Navision at the time and it was like kind of animated.

00:28:26.132 --> 00:28:32.876
I mean very rudimentary, right, but I literally had to drive four hours and take a ferry to give this CD-ROM to somebody on the San Juan Islands, and I mean, right, san.

00:28:32.896 --> 00:28:32.998
Juan.

00:28:33.018 --> 00:28:33.299
Islands.

00:28:33.299 --> 00:29:04.269
This wasn't that long ago I mean, it's a little while ago we won't age me too much, but this isn't that long ago it used to be about who could get in front of the person right, who was there physically, who was attentive enough, and now everything that was probably on that is is something that you would want to put out there on a much more generic, much more accessible informational site, right, essentially a much broader audience.

00:29:04.269 --> 00:29:11.366
But I think this is also where we saw as the product, the core product, got a little more general.

00:29:11.366 --> 00:29:26.550
This is where we saw that emergence of verticalization right, like really focusing on industry and we know your industry, we know your processes and then you know from there it's okay.

00:29:26.550 --> 00:29:27.613
Well, are we local?

00:29:27.613 --> 00:29:36.426
Are we not local, or do, as, as Brandy mentioned, do we have the larger support team or do we have the more boutique firm because you want this white glove service?

00:29:37.208 --> 00:29:41.242
Going circling this all back to our progress over perfection.

00:29:41.242 --> 00:30:01.551
Where I think a lot of providers software providers maybe got misdirected was they were focusing on the 20% outliers, right, and thinking that if they could just capture or target the broadest audience, what if somebody's bigger?

00:30:01.551 --> 00:30:02.493
What if somebody's smaller?

00:30:02.493 --> 00:30:05.346
What if they're this what if they have a bigger budget, a smaller budget?

00:30:05.346 --> 00:30:08.020
Let's make sure that we look like we can do it all.

00:30:08.020 --> 00:30:19.913
I think that's where a lot of organizations got misdirected in this transfer from like these on-premise you're in person, you know software solutions to more of these accessible cloud.

00:30:19.913 --> 00:30:48.771
I mean, you know what an ERP can do for the price these days is just uncomparable to what it could do 20 years ago, right, and so again, it's really about that distinction and there's multiple ways to do that Verticalization, team makeup, culture, resources, those types of things but it is so important and it has obviously evolved over the time.

00:30:49.881 --> 00:30:51.307
I think technology has added to it.

00:30:51.307 --> 00:30:57.689
I have a whole list here that I've been keeping track of questions, so do you want me to fire them all at you, or do you want me to do them one at a time?

00:30:58.601 --> 00:31:01.750
It's your show, man, we could do rapid fire it's not.

00:31:03.402 --> 00:31:04.263
So we talked about.

00:31:04.263 --> 00:31:06.190
It's not my show, it's your show.

00:31:06.190 --> 00:31:07.825
You are the stars of this show.

00:31:07.845 --> 00:31:08.688
You are the stars.

00:31:08.768 --> 00:31:12.888
Yes, it's hard marketing, sir, like we are used to it being everyone else's show.

00:31:15.621 --> 00:31:17.728
Well, this is an exception.

00:31:17.768 --> 00:31:18.430
This is your show.

00:31:18.941 --> 00:31:20.664
You make everybody else's show look good.

00:31:20.664 --> 00:31:22.028
How's that that?

00:31:22.028 --> 00:31:27.484
Is so therefore it is, Therefore it show look good, how's that that is so?

00:31:27.505 --> 00:31:28.106
therefore, you, it is.

00:31:28.106 --> 00:31:29.451
Therefore, it is your show, without it being your show.

00:31:29.451 --> 00:31:30.653
Yeah, we're the quiet, we're the quiet stars.

00:31:30.673 --> 00:31:31.516
I like that well.

00:31:31.516 --> 00:31:34.122
I think marketing is one of those.

00:31:34.122 --> 00:31:47.574
In my opinion, marketing is one of those that it's tough to measure the results at times because it can take time and how can you quantify certain things that you're marketing?

00:31:47.574 --> 00:31:50.409
Because you may do a specific campaign to go with what you're talking about.

00:31:50.409 --> 00:31:54.010
This is my opinion, so just tell me if I'm off base before I get into the questions.

00:31:54.010 --> 00:32:05.467
So if they're going to look at 13 or 15 pieces of content, that may be over a span of time, because if we're talking with that Microsoft Dynamics 365 Business Central, that's not something.

00:32:05.467 --> 00:32:09.253
Somebody wakes up one morning and goes, huh, I need a new ERP system.

00:32:09.253 --> 00:32:10.585
I'm going to buy it.

00:32:10.585 --> 00:32:12.664
Tara, can you sell it to me?

00:32:12.664 --> 00:32:13.729
All right, install it tomorrow.

00:32:13.729 --> 00:32:21.513
It's usually a process for them to get to the point where they reach out to somebody by doing some research for solving problems.

00:32:23.261 --> 00:32:23.944
Long-term play.

00:32:24.859 --> 00:32:25.442
Yes for solving problems.

00:32:25.442 --> 00:32:25.865
So long-term play yes.

00:32:25.865 --> 00:32:29.247
So you may have campaigns or such that were from chris and I talk about.

00:32:29.247 --> 00:32:30.894
We do presentations that shows.

00:32:30.894 --> 00:32:34.145
You'll hear from someone two years later saying a conference, events, conference.

00:32:34.145 --> 00:32:35.911
See, I can't speak, we have to just fix all this.

00:32:35.911 --> 00:32:41.132
So and they'll say well, we talked with you two years ago and now we're looking to do something.

00:32:41.132 --> 00:32:59.808
So tell me more and it to me it's tough to measure, but it's also important because you do need to be in front of people with all of the information that's accessible to somebody behind the keyboard, because I can sit here and type up a quick search right now in between a conversation and have a lot of information and read quickly.

00:32:59.808 --> 00:33:02.560
So it's a matter of getting that information out there.

00:33:02.560 --> 00:33:18.090
How can someone and you mentioned that one important thing with this is don't sell Dynamics 365, sell solving a problem or sell what makes you different from others how can someone determine what truly makes them different from others?

00:33:18.090 --> 00:33:19.865
That's market.

00:33:19.904 --> 00:33:20.567
Do they even know?

00:33:20.567 --> 00:33:22.980
Sometimes they don't know what makes them unique.

00:33:22.980 --> 00:33:24.431
That's my question is how?

00:33:24.592 --> 00:33:28.885
how do you determine what that may be and how do you pull that?

00:33:28.885 --> 00:33:30.067
There's an exercise right.

00:33:30.548 --> 00:33:41.660
Yeah, I mean, at some stage the company matures right and they they start to need more leads or more sales to keep themselves going.

00:33:41.660 --> 00:33:46.690
And that's usually the point where they start to reach out to an agency or look at augmenting their marketing.

00:33:46.690 --> 00:33:54.622
They're moving their marketing from making it like an off the side of the desk thing that somebody has to do to actually being something that they focus on.

00:33:54.622 --> 00:34:04.930
And you know, in that transition and when that happens, people have to really start thinking about, like, how did you get here?

00:34:04.930 --> 00:34:06.803
What makes your current customers happy?

00:34:06.803 --> 00:34:14.411
I mean, the best, the quickest way to find out what differentiates you from your competitor is go talk to a few customers and ask them how they feel about you.

00:34:14.411 --> 00:34:25.625
Ask the ones that love you, ask the ones that you've had challenges and overcome, and ask the ones even that maybe are still in the midst of a challenge with you and just figure out what they would say.

00:34:25.625 --> 00:34:28.992
What would they tell somebody else about working with your organization?

00:34:28.992 --> 00:34:31.045
That's kind of where we start the base of this.

00:34:31.045 --> 00:34:33.451
There is a whole exercise to Chris's point.

00:34:33.451 --> 00:34:40.222
He may have been put through part of it at some point in his life and, you know, as something that we work on.

00:34:40.222 --> 00:34:45.914
When we have new customers on board, is this foundational element, right?

00:34:45.914 --> 00:34:52.760
So if we have someone come to us and say we need a new website, we're like that's fantastic, we love that we can do that for you.

00:34:53.664 --> 00:34:54.786
Why, what's it about?

00:34:54.786 --> 00:34:57.012
Well, we want to sell Dynamics, right?

00:34:57.012 --> 00:35:00.742
You and 7,500 other people to my left.

00:35:00.742 --> 00:35:02.972
What do you actually want to do?

00:35:02.972 --> 00:35:04.215
You don't actually like.

00:35:04.215 --> 00:35:07.425
Do you wake up in the morning and think I want to sell Dynamics 365?

00:35:07.425 --> 00:35:08.768
Probably not.

00:35:08.768 --> 00:35:10.210
What do you want to do?

00:35:10.210 --> 00:35:16.041
You want to help a nonprofit get a better handle on everything so that they can contribute back to the community better.

00:35:16.041 --> 00:35:24.590
You are really jazzed about inventory velocity and making sure stuff doesn't sit on shelves and you really feel good when you help somebody uncover that mess.

00:35:24.590 --> 00:35:35.300
Maybe you're just somebody who loves to support and you just know so much about the technology and it really gets you fired up and you want to contribute that back to another tech team at.

00:35:35.300 --> 00:35:44.266
You know your customer organization, so starting to look at like what motivates you and your company to continue to do this that isn't just to get a paycheck.

00:35:44.547 --> 00:35:45.047
Understood.

00:35:45.047 --> 00:35:53.579
And I think the exercise would be important because I talk with many and I don't know if they really even understand themselves what they're trying to do.

00:35:53.579 --> 00:35:58.340
And it's not that they're not good at what they do, it's not that they're not passionate, they're not successful.

00:35:58.340 --> 00:36:00.065
Sometimes it's difficult to pinpoint.

00:36:00.065 --> 00:36:08.925
Like you said, let's identify in reality what are the key, distinct bullet points of what makes us different.

00:36:08.925 --> 00:36:09.327
It's, it's tough to.

00:36:09.327 --> 00:36:11.711
It's almost like writing a bio about yourself.

00:36:11.711 --> 00:36:18.235
You almost you need someone to pull it out of you versus you writing it yourself, because you may miss.

00:36:18.235 --> 00:36:26.621
Some people will over exaggerate and some people be extremely humble and cut themselves short, to put it in my terms Exactly.

00:36:26.742 --> 00:36:30.632
And you have to be willing to accept that that's an integral part of this exercise.

00:36:30.632 --> 00:36:46.152
So I would say that one thing that comes up in, you know, with us all the time, with new prospects and in marketing in general, is this sort of concept that marketing is this like tap, like we need a lead, turn it on, throw out a campaign, get some stuff in, turn it off because it's expensive, sales guy's job.

00:36:46.152 --> 00:36:56.353
Now and this is where the sales and marketing rub always come in but believing that marketing is going to work for you, when you treat it like that, is the start of your problem.

00:36:56.353 --> 00:37:07.449
Right, because this is an integrated situation and you have to build that foundation, otherwise, like we call it, like throwing spaghetti at the wall, like we can do that all day I can do it.

00:37:07.449 --> 00:37:10.556
You have to build that foundation, otherwise, like we call it, like throwing spaghetti at the wall, like we can do that all day.

00:37:10.577 --> 00:37:11.137
I can do it all day.

00:37:11.137 --> 00:37:11.818
I can send campaigns all day.

00:37:11.838 --> 00:37:13.659
That sounds fun, you might throw spaghetti against the wall.

00:37:13.659 --> 00:37:43.994
To Brad's point, it's very hard to get to any sort of like success metrics when all you're doing is like spraying everything out the hope and pray method, right, yeah, that's not the best and most strategic way to leverage your marketing resources, but getting people to understand that marketing is more than just a side administrative function or standing up a campaign or having a LinkedIn page is actually a big challenge that I think we face when we're dealing with prospects, and I think, internally, that a lot of the companies face themselves.

00:37:45.248 --> 00:37:54.378
The way I look at it too, it's like, um, you, when, when I have this conversation and and Brandy, I've gone through that, you know branding conversation like who are you?

00:37:54.378 --> 00:38:02.606
And and the way I look at it, it's almost like I want to catch fish, okay, what kind of fish you know?

00:38:02.606 --> 00:38:07.034
And there's like there's like a there's different oceans and lakes.

00:38:07.034 --> 00:38:16.277
I want to catch freshwater fish or I want to catch tuna, and then you're, you know, maybe you're fishing out in a different ocean or there's no tuna there, but then you're wasting your time, right.

00:38:16.277 --> 00:38:29.219
So it's very, very important for all organizations and at least the ones that I've worked with where you have to identify that fairly quickly of, like, what kind of fish you want to go after, and not just any fish.

00:38:29.219 --> 00:38:35.697
So it's important to go through that exercise to really identify okay, what kind of a fisherman are you?

00:38:37.286 --> 00:38:39.333
And what kind of lure do you need right?

00:38:39.333 --> 00:38:41.030
Or a pole or a boat?

00:38:41.552 --> 00:38:49.996
Exactly, that's extremely important and it's for anything, I think, from a sales point, it's understanding your target and you have to define a target.

00:38:49.996 --> 00:39:06.567
And the answer can't be to Chris's point every fish on the planet, because it's not feasible for you to be able to catch every fish in the planet, because saltwater versus freshwater, you have different bait, small fish versus large fish, some fish will eat frogs, some fish will eat crickets, so your bait's there.

00:39:06.567 --> 00:39:21.536
But talking with this and you're talking about the marketing campaigns and not just throwing and spraying I think that you had mentioned Tara it's how long we had mentioned that.

00:39:21.536 --> 00:39:25.585
Already now we have to go through an exercise, to bring it to simple terms.

00:39:25.585 --> 00:39:36.498
So an exercise of identifying how we're different from others, also identifying who our target is like, who is our ideal customer in this case, or ideal fish.

00:39:36.498 --> 00:39:42.617
Once we have that done, we need to determine, to come up with a plan to market to them.

00:39:44.105 --> 00:39:46.793
How do you and you have to be searchable.

00:39:46.793 --> 00:39:47.373
It's what your point was.

00:39:47.373 --> 00:39:48.277
How do you and you have to be searchable?

00:39:48.277 --> 00:39:51.786
It's what your point was how do you determine where to market?

00:39:51.786 --> 00:39:52.849
You had mentioned linkedin.

00:39:52.849 --> 00:39:55.054
I had a conversation with someone the other day.

00:39:55.054 --> 00:39:59.384
They said and I don't ever use it, unless somebody sends me a link and I click on it tiktok, they said.

00:39:59.384 --> 00:40:01.447
Well, tiktok is a big advertiser.

00:40:01.447 --> 00:40:03.949
Used to be instagram, used to be facebook.

00:40:03.949 --> 00:40:05.751
You have web pages, you have websites.

00:40:05.751 --> 00:40:08.855
You have different events that look for sponsors.

00:40:08.855 --> 00:40:17.253
How can you determine who, excuse me, how can you determine where you could market yourself?

00:40:17.253 --> 00:40:18.496
Or do you have to just do everything?

00:40:19.445 --> 00:40:27.505
Well, it's not financially feasible to do everything unless you are Microsoft, so that's part of where you start, right, is that Dara?

00:40:28.746 --> 00:40:29.626
Microsoft.

00:40:29.626 --> 00:40:32.407
So that's part of where you start, right, is that, dara?

00:40:32.407 --> 00:40:32.807
Yeah, I mean, there's.

00:40:32.807 --> 00:40:34.588
There's a lot of different.

00:40:34.588 --> 00:40:48.378
We're specifically working in the B2B space, right, and so there already are certain outlets that are just a little more successful than others, based on what we know, right.

00:40:49.077 --> 00:40:56.663
One really popular method is LinkedIn, as you mentioned, brad, account-based marketing.

00:40:56.663 --> 00:41:02.916
Do you know the profile of the companies or the people at those companies?

00:41:02.916 --> 00:41:04.559
And that goes back to the foundation.

00:41:04.559 --> 00:41:07.331
There is a way to target them through that.

00:41:07.331 --> 00:41:11.518
Through you know the information that they have on their LinkedIn profiles.

00:41:11.518 --> 00:41:12.804
That can be very effective.

00:41:12.804 --> 00:41:16.110
It can also be very expensive.

00:41:17.172 --> 00:41:29.967
So another way is searching, now that you've identified, okay, what are the compelling events that happen with your target audience before they come to you, happen, um, with your target audience before they come to you?

00:41:29.967 --> 00:41:30.730
That's another really good question.

00:41:30.730 --> 00:41:33.235
To sort of start to identify what your target market looks like.

00:41:33.235 --> 00:41:34.277
What are these?

00:41:34.277 --> 00:41:37.793
What is happening to them prior to them seeking solutions?

00:41:37.793 --> 00:41:40.157
You start to look at search terms.

00:41:40.157 --> 00:41:46.989
What are they looking for on the internet to solve their problems, or, um, to reach the goal that they want to reach?

00:41:46.989 --> 00:41:50.077
And, um, you start to look at the viability of those.

00:41:50.077 --> 00:41:52.673
So, before you put, obviously, any money into it.

00:41:52.673 --> 00:41:58.713
There are ways to see okay, these people are searching for this or they're not searching for this and there's this volume for this.

00:41:59.766 --> 00:42:01.773
And you have to look at your existing assets.

00:42:01.773 --> 00:42:05.844
Do you have a list of people you've met previously?

00:42:05.844 --> 00:42:09.567
Are there people that go to certain events that fit your profile?

00:42:09.567 --> 00:42:14.440
You do have to lay it out and start to say okay to get any.

00:42:14.961 --> 00:42:25.748
You know it is a full exercise as the next step to decide where you put your money, but it's not going to be perfect the first time.

00:42:25.748 --> 00:42:26.731
You do it right.

00:42:26.731 --> 00:42:28.817
There's baselines that you need to.

00:42:28.817 --> 00:42:49.050
You know what was successful in paid media and using these search terms versus what was successful in LinkedIn or what was successful at these events, to see where do you turn the dials right, what dials should we shift down and what dials should we shift up, and that's a constant, ever-evolving, ever-changing thing that you always want to look at.

00:42:49.050 --> 00:43:04.456
But even upfront, it's going to take you some baseline to figure out, okay, which one is doing the best or seems to be yielding the most results in terms of converting or engagement, that sort of thing.

00:43:04.456 --> 00:43:18.632
So you do have to do a little trial and error, but you can do enough legwork up front once you've identified your target audience, that being the biggest right importance there to start to see what works.

00:43:20.896 --> 00:43:31.380
Once you go through all that, you mentioned that you'd be able to measure, like their search terms, or measure the results of your campaigns, is what you're talking about, or where you're marketing.

00:43:32.726 --> 00:43:42.940
How do you determine that and how long would you say that it takes for something to become effective to where it is searchable?

00:43:42.940 --> 00:43:57.731
And I hate to say this because I don't like talking about it I had a session about a month ago and I told everybody I wouldn't say the word in the session because I'm sick of hearing it all the time Now that there are AI tools that bring results back.

00:43:57.731 --> 00:44:06.795
So what considerations should you make for tools such as AI that may bring information back or search differently?

00:44:06.795 --> 00:44:17.572
Then I know there are also blockers, ad blockers and such that may inhibit some information being obtained of the effectiveness of the campaign.

00:44:17.572 --> 00:44:22.193
And that also goes back to the question of see, I have them all here and I'm just trying to get them all out before I forget.

00:44:22.193 --> 00:44:23.516
That's it.

00:44:23.516 --> 00:44:26.333
I do it on purpose sometimes just to see which ones you can remember.

00:44:26.333 --> 00:44:33.766
Sure, or actually the truth is, and I'll say it now, for everybody.

00:44:33.786 --> 00:44:34.688
I just say them all so I don't forget.

00:44:34.688 --> 00:44:36.030
Yeah, we know the secret.

00:44:36.530 --> 00:44:40.215
Now you know the secret, it's out because Brandy and I are best friends.

00:44:40.215 --> 00:44:43.179
Now I could share that secret with my best friend.

00:44:43.179 --> 00:44:58.496
But how long would it take for a campaign to be measurable I'm not saying effective, because the campaign may not be proper or appropriate based upon the conditions that you put for selection of audience or selection of information, the key for the differentiator itself.

00:44:58.496 --> 00:45:06.032
But what is the time period that you should wait and what are the considerations that also you can make for the technology of today to make yourself appear?

00:45:07.516 --> 00:45:12.391
It'd be so amazing if marketing was even remotely as linear as you're asking this question of.

00:45:12.391 --> 00:45:15.454
Unfortunately, it's difficult, right?

00:45:15.454 --> 00:45:31.005
If you're starting from a good place and you've got some brand recognition, you've got some good domain authority on your website, you've got good people working on your stuff, you can tell within a few if it's like an email marketing campaign.

00:45:31.005 --> 00:45:36.085
After the first two emails you have a pretty good idea of if this is going to do well or not.

00:45:36.085 --> 00:45:46.275
Right, Like the first email is always the best and then they kind of drop down and so if your first email is a flop, you are pretty ready for the rest of it, to kind of do that.

00:45:46.898 --> 00:45:58.996
But when you're looking at something like your organic campaigns or your paid media campaigns, those are a lot harder to really quantify in terms of time and it also depends on what matters to you, right?

00:45:58.996 --> 00:46:03.152
So we have some customers and one deal to them is a success.

00:46:03.152 --> 00:46:11.077
Whatever they're selling, whatever they need to do, is so valuable to them that just one deal makes the whole campaign a success.

00:46:11.077 --> 00:46:29.855
Where we have other customers, they need 30 deals for them to consider it a success because they're more transactional or it's a smaller piece of the pie for them that we're working on, and so it's really it sort of it depends on a lot of factors, and I do hate to say that it depends, because I think that's a bit of a trite answer when you're asking for specifics but a true consultant.

00:46:30.556 --> 00:46:34.547
Everything is, it depends um, but you know it does it, it is.

00:46:34.547 --> 00:46:51.650
It is difficult, and I think you know if, if you take anything away from it, it's that you need to launch a campaign from a place where you feel like you gave it as much attention as you expect to get in return, and so you need to build the pieces that go with it.

00:46:51.650 --> 00:46:56.635
Sometimes the campaigns are meant to just be like let's see if something happens, and that's okay.

00:46:56.635 --> 00:46:59.346
Doing something is always better than doing nothing.

00:47:00.668 --> 00:47:13.958
So, to go back to your point of marketing being not so linear, I am not that unique, so I'm thankful that we're having this conversation because I'm certain that many others may have a similar question of how do I do this.

00:47:13.958 --> 00:47:27.739
But I heard in your response to the question put some sort of success metric in the campaign along with I guess, take out the time but put in, as you had mentioned, if we get one deal.

00:47:27.739 --> 00:47:31.293
I guess take out the time but put in, as you had mentioned, if we get one deal, the campaign successful, we're happy.

00:47:31.293 --> 00:47:37.132
Instead of we're going to send out 700 emails, for example, and we get seven, we expect to have 700 replies because everybody loves us.

00:47:37.132 --> 00:47:48.202
So it's just a matter of having some sort of realistic metric of what is successful to me in a realistic fashion and sometimes it's brand awareness campaigns.

00:47:48.262 --> 00:47:53.295
Right, sometimes you're not even necessarily working on a direct like I need a lead to give to sales.

00:47:53.295 --> 00:47:56.771
It's just, you know, I need someone to know that we exist.

00:47:56.771 --> 00:47:58.516
I need people to start talking about us.

00:47:58.516 --> 00:48:05.766
We're a new ISV or coming to North America for the first time, or we just got a cash injection and we want to do more.

00:48:05.766 --> 00:48:07.269
Well, no one's ever heard of you.

00:48:07.269 --> 00:48:12.503
So what can we do to even just drive some brand awareness amongst this channel?

00:48:12.503 --> 00:48:30.730
Right, as we talked about at the beginning, this channel is we've all been here for a long time People know somebody everywhere and so you know when it, when you're looking internally, some of it is just getting that name recognition out there, so that you are somebody that that somebody else feels that they could trust or do business with.

00:48:32.715 --> 00:48:39.974
Yeah, you know, we did a workshop, um, at, at an event last year where we we talked a lot about campaigns.

00:48:39.974 --> 00:48:41.704
So you want to build a campaign, right?

00:48:41.704 --> 00:48:46.510
Um, and there is two parts to this right.

00:48:46.510 --> 00:48:55.541
But one thing we really emphasized was when you build your campaign, yes, you can lay out the metrics that you are going to track.

00:48:55.541 --> 00:49:10.346
Are you going to track clicks, track conversions, track how many leads ended up becoming sales, qualified, sales qualified?

00:49:10.346 --> 00:49:16.485
There are probably as many metrics across as many campaign concepts that we could spend an eternity sort of discussing or diving into right, but decide which ones you are going to track.

00:49:16.485 --> 00:49:23.958
More importantly, define, like, clearly define the objective and the goal.

00:49:23.958 --> 00:49:26.610
Right, because you could track all these metrics.

00:49:26.610 --> 00:49:34.505
But to Brandy's point, which metric matters?

00:49:34.505 --> 00:49:35.007
Right, what is your goal?

00:49:35.007 --> 00:49:35.688
Are you getting brand recognition?

00:49:35.688 --> 00:49:41.771
Are you trying to just get LinkedIn followers or are you really trying to get people to fill out a form to discuss a very specific solution with you?

00:49:41.771 --> 00:49:44.961
Those are two very different things.

00:49:44.961 --> 00:50:09.342
So it's really important that you define it, because what we see too often is that people throw a lot of money, a lot of resources and a lot of capacity at building campaigns and they're not actually thinking about how are we going to measure what the success of this was or what the outcome was afraid to also, I think, be honest with themselves sometimes, like what if we don't hit four sales?00:50:09.342 --> 00:50:11.568


Or what if we don't hit 10 sales?00:50:11.568 --> 00:50:13.333


Or what if we don't hit 50 leads?00:50:13.333 --> 00:50:14.514


That's okay.00:50:14.514 --> 00:50:19.192


Put a stick in the ground so you can say this worked, this didn't.00:50:19.192 --> 00:50:23.893


We're going to change it next time, because that's how great marketing evolves.00:50:23.893 --> 00:50:33.054


Right Is being honest with yourself and seeing what actually worked to meet the objective, and the objectives can be different across different campaigns.00:50:33.956 --> 00:50:39.360


The other thing I just want to add is that you will start to see metrics instantly, right.00:50:39.360 --> 00:50:40.864


The second something launches.00:50:40.864 --> 00:50:46.213


You're going to start to see opens, clicks, cost per click, all that stuff.00:50:46.213 --> 00:50:49.840


That will all be data you start to get right away.00:50:49.840 --> 00:51:00.713


You do have to get those some directional, like you know information about that data, which means you do have to let things run for a period of time.00:51:00.773 --> 00:51:03.467


I think that kind of goes back to your original question.00:51:03.467 --> 00:51:07.112


But well, how long do you do it before you decide it works or it doesn't work?00:51:07.112 --> 00:51:16.755


I think if you're starting a new let's say, paid media initiative, you've never done it before and you want to try it out and you're going to do these search terms or whatnot.00:51:16.755 --> 00:51:25.447


Anybody is likely going to tell you, or we would likely tell you, you got to let something run for 60 to 90 days to baseline it.00:51:25.447 --> 00:51:39.134


It doesn't mean you don't see some directional data after two to three weeks where you can make some tweaks and be like, okay, you know, this search term or this campaign or this segment of this is working really well, this one isn't so much.00:51:39.134 --> 00:51:42.304


Let's dial this one up, let's dial this one down, see if it changes.00:51:42.304 --> 00:51:52.695


But don't just try it, for you know four weeks and then be like, well, that did or didn't work, that that probably won't give you the directional data that you're looking for.00:51:56.005 --> 00:52:00.653


And with the consideration how do you think AI?00:52:00.653 --> 00:52:04.494


And the reason why I'm asking I hate to bring it up because I hate to talk about it, cause it's not everything.00:52:04.494 --> 00:52:08.231


World's not AI centric, as much as everybody may think it is.00:52:08.231 --> 00:52:12.257


Uh, or maybe it is, and I'm just it's affecting everyone.00:52:12.257 --> 00:52:22.193


It does affect everybody, but I saw somebody post something and I forget where it was the other day and they said well, they got their first lead from ai and it's one I.00:52:22.193 --> 00:52:24.958


I'm curious to know how you can track it back to AI.00:52:25.559 --> 00:52:35.853


You know somebody prompting AI and getting a result, but how do you feel that that impacts somebody's marketing campaigns?00:52:35.853 --> 00:52:40.190


I'll use the word campaign versus the traditional campaigns, right, traditional campaigns again.00:52:40.190 --> 00:52:45.090


Over the course of the years you had mailings, flyers, emails, ads on websites.00:52:45.090 --> 00:52:57.280


There's what I would call traditional, but now with search, search in my opinion, being condensed, because now even on google or uh, what's the other one?00:52:57.280 --> 00:52:58.824


Google, microsoft?00:52:59.324 --> 00:53:03.909


the other search engines bang see, I told you I'm, but it's now you get like.00:53:03.909 --> 00:53:07.393


You get the AI response at the top of your results.00:53:07.393 --> 00:53:14.902


That has links to it, along with the listed websites or pieces of content that match your result.00:53:14.902 --> 00:53:17.132


What are some considerations?00:53:17.132 --> 00:53:27.536


One how does that impact your campaign with everything that we've spoken about, and what are some considerations someone could make so that it can be in that top summary for problem solving?00:53:34.264 --> 00:53:48.659


So if we go back to the start of our conversation, when we talked about the 12 to 15 or 13 to 17 pieces of content that somebody wants to interact with you with before they talk to you, that is basically what's going to feed those AI snippets, and so to the degree, just like SEO, it's garbage in and garbage out Whatever you have.00:53:48.659 --> 00:54:08.806


So companies that have spent the last three, five, ten years building thought leadership content, focusing on helping people solve their problems, meeting the buyers where they are, are going to be a lot better than the companies that are running what we refer to as brochure websites, which is like here's the product, here's our location, here's how you get a hold of us.00:54:08.806 --> 00:54:25.639


Those companies are going to lose ground a lot more quickly in the AI space in terms of that searchability Because, even beyond what you're talking about, at Google IO last year they announced that they are not going to serve links at some point.00:54:25.639 --> 00:54:28.072


Google will not give you a link to a website.00:54:28.072 --> 00:54:30.829


Eventually they want it to be an enclosed system.00:54:30.829 --> 00:54:37.545


Now they announced this and then they had to sort of reconcile what they're going to do about getting money out of the paid ads and those kinds of things.00:54:37.545 --> 00:54:45.449


I think they have pulled back a little bit on it, but in their ideal world, they're not serving a link to your website anymore at all.00:54:45.449 --> 00:54:46.952


They're answering your question.00:54:46.952 --> 00:54:48.577


You're staying in Google.00:54:48.577 --> 00:54:49.891


Google is your friend now.00:54:50.804 --> 00:54:53.474


And so how do you become the answer to those questions?00:54:53.474 --> 00:54:55.913


Well, you have to have the content on your website.00:54:55.913 --> 00:55:01.398


You have to have the people in your organization that actually live, breathe and die by what you're talking about.00:55:01.398 --> 00:55:07.016


So, hiring 25 consultants to come in and be like well, I have a team of 30.00:55:07.016 --> 00:55:14.509


Well, do any of them know what they're talking about?00:55:14.509 --> 00:55:16.777


If they don't, you're not going to necessarily beat the person with the five-person team next door.00:55:16.777 --> 00:55:26.929


It's really about, like, we are at a place where your thought leadership, your ability to demonstrate your expertise to a robot, may be the most important thing you can do, like right now, today, in this transition.00:55:27.690 --> 00:55:30.056


So you mentioned thought leadership.00:55:30.056 --> 00:55:31.298


You mentioned thought leadership.00:55:31.298 --> 00:55:33.873


Now I want to kind of break this down further.00:55:33.873 --> 00:55:35.891


And you mentioned that there's different channels.00:55:35.891 --> 00:55:40.385


You know 11 to 13 different places you put content.00:55:40.385 --> 00:55:48.259


Which one of those brings more weight into being found?00:55:48.259 --> 00:55:51.434


Is it more thought leadership or you're All of them together?00:55:51.434 --> 00:55:53.211


All of them together?00:55:53.211 --> 00:55:54.297


Okay.00:55:55.503 --> 00:55:55.605


Yeah.00:55:56.251 --> 00:55:56.963


I liked what you said.00:55:57.025 --> 00:56:01.016


Having one post on LinkedIn irrelevant, nobody cares.00:56:01.016 --> 00:56:03.514


One post is not helping you.00:56:03.514 --> 00:56:17.393


You spending the last however many years you've spent building up a personality on LinkedIn and then having that reflected in your podcast, in conversations you have places, in sessions you lead at conferences, in write-ups that people have about you.00:56:17.393 --> 00:56:22.255


This is building the story of who you are and it's becoming a lot more.00:56:22.255 --> 00:56:28.355


The individual is becoming more relevant than the company as a whole in this transition period.00:56:28.355 --> 00:56:29.949


This is why you're seeing such an.00:56:29.949 --> 00:56:30.733


I love that.00:56:30.733 --> 00:56:32.268


Can you repeat that?00:56:33.030 --> 00:56:35.016


in stereo you might not even have to.00:56:35.105 --> 00:56:36.985


We might just have to loop that over and over.00:56:36.985 --> 00:56:40.994


I say that time and time again in this world.00:56:40.994 --> 00:56:52.606


It's all coming down to people, all coming down to people.00:56:52.606 --> 00:56:54.251


Where it is the individual, even in consulting that, we all know the space well.00:56:54.251 --> 00:56:55.596


People work with people.00:56:55.596 --> 00:57:00.728


They have I use the word loosely a relationship with the people of the team that they have.00:57:00.728 --> 00:57:03.615


It's not the company exactly.00:57:03.615 --> 00:57:05.125


The company brings them together.00:57:05.125 --> 00:57:11.789


The company may have other talented individuals or a group of individual, but it's the team that's servicing your fish.00:57:11.789 --> 00:57:33.855


To Chris's point, that are the most important part a strategy right, and then every component of that's just your uh tactical approach of individual um component.00:57:33.875 --> 00:57:35.398


But the whole thing is a strategy to get.00:57:35.398 --> 00:57:56.478


You have to get all 11 to 13 things to you know to make it all work to to get results and it takes time yeah, I think it's also important to just like keep in mind, right, google's been changing consistently and constantly changing their algorithms for years.00:57:56.585 --> 00:57:59.675


I mean, I mean years and years and years, ever since they were Google.00:57:59.675 --> 00:58:30.148


And the one thing, though, that hasn't really changed too much in those algorithms is what has what holds weight and time and stands the test of time right, like websites that have been there longer, or content that is constantly getting built off of a site right, that always um holds a lot of weight with google, and, and ai is another component right right of this evolution and the changing algorithms.00:58:30.148 --> 00:58:42.065


But what we kind of like to remind people is that what you want tomorrow, you need to have started yesterday, because the one thing you'll never buy is time right.00:58:42.065 --> 00:58:48.333


And so I think a lot of organizations think, oh, now there's AI or now there's this, and they're very reactive.00:58:49.326 --> 00:58:50.387


How do we address this?00:58:50.387 --> 00:58:51.130


How do we get this?00:58:51.130 --> 00:58:54.235


The thing is, it's a long game.00:58:54.235 --> 00:59:18.572


You need to create the thought leadership culture and you need to really invest in that and that content and that value add out there right on the internet, and that will always wait more than just yeah, like Brandy said, like a few social posts or like oh okay, let's just build a new site today and then it'll be different and it'll be better.00:59:18.572 --> 00:59:29.755


Yeah, it might have the better schemas in it, but you still have to feed that over time to show that you know you're a player in the game that you're trying to get in front of.00:59:30.485 --> 00:59:34.358


I think the AI thing is an interesting opportunity in our space.00:59:34.478 --> 00:59:45.836


I know in the technology space, there's lots of different things that it's being used for, but it is an interesting thing when you look at what Google is preferencing and when you're looking at how things are coming together.00:59:46.625 --> 01:00:00.054


All that Google's doing right now, at the bare bones of it, is trying to determine what was done by a human and what was done by an AI so that it can deprioritize what was done by an AI, which is hilarious, because they're using an AI to deprioritize the AI.01:00:08.184 --> 01:00:18.827


All of the updates that they're doing and they're looking like I think it's probably not Google so much as Bing, but Bing is actually doing work on where they can sort of match your LinkedIn content, because they can get into there with exterior content about you and say, like, does this sound like Brad?01:00:18.827 --> 01:00:23.264


Does it actually feel like Brad is writing his LinkedIn content and his sessions?01:00:23.264 --> 01:00:28.806


Or is this two different people a marketing person pretending to be Brad and actual Brad?01:00:28.806 --> 01:00:38.019


Right, the AI is actually actively trying to suppress when somebody's faking it or when it's AI content that was generated, or when it's not real thought leadership.01:00:38.019 --> 01:00:55.617


That's all they're working on, and so, to the degree that you've just established a base of expertise in your space, you're going to come up a lot better than somebody who has been sort of trying to grift off the idea of like content, spamming or whatever right.01:00:55.617 --> 01:00:58.251


They're trying to determine who's a real person.01:00:58.994 --> 01:01:08.958


That could change in time, though, right, because as it gets, as it improves and you know, now you could teach AI how to sound like you and, you know, feed it.01:01:08.978 --> 01:01:22.547


That's going to be a tough one to help you work these days it's a little complicated, but yeah, I mean, and that's, it is going to change probably before we continue, let the record state, counselor, that brad is brad.01:01:22.907 --> 01:01:28.778


The only thing brad uses is grammarly is a great tool which I've used for a long time to just.01:01:29.507 --> 01:01:30.952


AI built in there, Brad.01:01:31.032 --> 01:01:31.454


I don't know.01:01:31.454 --> 01:01:39.918


It does have AI to help improve some of your sentences, but you don't have to use it.01:01:39.918 --> 01:01:52.474


I sometimes will dictate in a rant what I want to say and some of the things that I post, because I'm mobile or somewhere and I'll have to use gramly or something to go back to clean it up.01:01:52.474 --> 01:01:58.713


But brad is brad at this point until we feed it with your voice.01:01:58.793 --> 01:02:01.597


Man, look, look, these are all recorded, right?01:02:01.597 --> 01:02:06.697


So anybody can download this episode and just feed it to ai and say I want you to sound like I'll tell you.01:02:06.777 --> 01:02:06.956


I did.01:02:06.956 --> 01:02:09.313


I used 11 labs before and I've had conversations.01:02:09.313 --> 01:02:17.172


I mean it wasn't as good as real time, but recording some snippets and I would love to have some conversations that way, which this is another PSA for that.01:02:17.172 --> 01:02:19.692


Speaking of the voices, this is how the tangents of my mind will go.01:02:19.692 --> 01:02:22.128


You need to have a safe word with people.01:02:22.771 --> 01:02:39.365


Because of AI and these conversations, I cannot tell you how many people that I've heard stories of and I've known firsthand where they've been almost scammed, because someone will say hey, dad, I'm stuck at the car dealership, can you send me $200 or $2,000 to get my car?01:02:39.365 --> 01:02:42.056


At that point you should say, okay, what's the safe word?01:02:42.056 --> 01:02:46.512


It's not some crazy questions, because now anybody can find anything about anybody on the internet.01:02:46.512 --> 01:02:48.905


It's not some crazy questions, because now anybody can find anything about anybody on the Internet.01:02:48.905 --> 01:02:50.351


You need to have a safe word that somebody can authenticate them.01:02:50.351 --> 01:02:56.954


Or I know someone that had someone call and say that they were broken down on the side of the road, like someone close to them was broken down on the side of the road to come pick them up.01:02:56.954 --> 01:02:57.777


They weren't there.01:02:57.777 --> 01:02:59.972


There was someone there that was ready to rob them.01:03:01.626 --> 01:03:03.552


This is how creative some of these scams are going.01:03:03.552 --> 01:03:04.514


You're talking about the voice, chris.01:03:04.514 --> 01:03:04.855


Scams are going.01:03:04.855 --> 01:03:05.476


You're talking about the voice.01:03:05.476 --> 01:03:06.617


Go back to my public service announcement.01:03:06.617 --> 01:03:09.400


Maybe we'll cut that out, maybe we won't, but everybody have a safe word.01:03:09.400 --> 01:03:10.300


That's all I have to say.01:03:10.766 --> 01:03:34.121


Chris, we need to have a safe word with you I know yeah I'm sorry, you fuck the tangent I wasn't sure how far I should go with it, but like this did actually happen to my in-laws, you know where they thought my stepson was calling them, because it is actually really scary.01:03:34.121 --> 01:03:37.951


And, and you're right, we talked about the safe word.01:03:38.905 --> 01:03:42.452


But see, just right here in the conversation of four I don't know Brandy and Chris.01:03:42.452 --> 01:03:47.298


If it's you know first and I'm talking firsthand, I'm not talking, I read it on the Internet.01:03:47.298 --> 01:03:50.724


If it's you know first and I'm talking firsthand, I'm not talking, I read it on the internet.01:03:50.724 --> 01:04:03.865


Like between four of us here, two of us know somebody close firsthand that had somebody try to use fake voices to take something from them, whatever that may be, and mine was money, I mean.01:04:03.865 --> 01:04:05.954


So if that's happened to you, then that's what I'm saying.01:04:05.954 --> 01:04:08.851


Look at the percentages of how good this is getting now, because it't take a lot.01:04:08.851 --> 01:04:10.637


You can automate a lot of that stuff now too.01:04:10.637 --> 01:04:11.688


So the safe word is good.01:04:11.688 --> 01:04:13.251


So, tara, thank you.01:04:13.251 --> 01:04:14.896


Now we're best friends, brandy see you.01:04:14.936 --> 01:04:17.570


Bye, brandy, you're still working on that.01:04:17.570 --> 01:04:20.460


You got progress going.01:04:20.460 --> 01:04:23.266


I got the progress I didn't get the other perfection.01:04:23.768 --> 01:04:54.699


You get me a yeti with progress and perfection, or even a big room yeti, so then I'll drink it and we'll be best friends you know, overall, I think we're we're kind of ai is is so broad, right, what it's affecting, and I think it does get very philosophical very quickly, right.01:04:54.699 --> 01:05:02.438


But if we're just speaking in terms of marketing or um, delivering software solutions, it it is.01:05:02.438 --> 01:05:02.860


Also.01:05:02.860 --> 01:05:16.494


There is some exciting stuff right, and I think that we shouldn't be just push it aside and be like tomorrow's problem, tomorrow's problem, right, because it really is affecting us today.01:05:16.494 --> 01:05:29.409


So being a part of that evolution and using it as a tool where it makes sense is really important, and also staying on top of okay, how can I build in strategies and execute them?01:05:29.409 --> 01:05:39.750


So it's going to meet AI where it is today and help me not be so reactive in the future where it's like oh oops, didn't do that, now what do you do?01:05:39.809 --> 01:05:53.277


right, so you're adapting to the AI revolution, whereas some marketing folks are like, no, I'm not, you know they're so against it, but sounds like you guys are adapting to that and make it part of your strategy.01:05:53.744 --> 01:05:58.856


Those people are either lying or almost retired and they don't want to learn something new.01:05:58.856 --> 01:06:07.190


Because I think it would be insane to believe that you could operate in a digital landscape these days without understanding what the AI is doing.01:06:07.190 --> 01:06:14.755


That doesn't mean you have to turn your job over to it, but it does mean you have to stay up, like you know, on top of it all.01:06:14.755 --> 01:06:16.271


And we do use it here, right.01:06:16.271 --> 01:06:22.655


We're not going to pretend like, oh well, we never would use it, and I think Chris and I had a conversation on LinkedIn about chat GT the other day.01:06:22.655 --> 01:06:33.496


But it's the same thing garbage in, garbage out right, I can use it to quickly get something done, because I can say I want X, y and Z in this format for this audience done this way.01:06:33.496 --> 01:06:34.947


I want you to look at this.01:06:34.947 --> 01:06:41.168


It has to sound, you can tell it all of those things and it will give you something that you can then start to work on right.01:06:41.550 --> 01:06:42.590


So now I have a draft.01:06:42.590 --> 01:06:45.114


That's 70% of the content that I want.01:06:45.114 --> 01:06:46.697


I still need to go in there.01:06:46.697 --> 01:06:54.072


I need to make sure that the headlines make sense, I need to make sure it makes sense for the brand voice, I need to put the links and the calls to action and all those things have to go in there.01:06:54.072 --> 01:07:07.315


I also had to start with something more than write me a blog post about inventory, because that is not any use to anybody and so you have to be an expert.01:07:07.315 --> 01:07:11.608


And then you have to use the ai to supplement that, not to replace it.01:07:11.608 --> 01:07:16.949


You're not going to get rid of a staff member and then be like, well, now all of the content's written by this ai.01:07:16.949 --> 01:07:20.777


It's like yes, we know intel, because it it reads it.01:07:20.777 --> 01:07:23.911


You can tell you use the word delve.01:07:25.072 --> 01:07:36.824


Oh, there's, there's so many words you can pick up on this landscape we delve into this inventory management man do I ever use any of those phrases.01:07:37.746 --> 01:07:51.057


See, I'll have to have to have to create content and say we need an anti-a, anti-ai agent to say that we need to make your text not sound like ai it will just spit back the same.01:07:51.980 --> 01:08:00.456


In today's dynamic business environment, if you google just that sentence, like 700 of the websites will come up.01:08:00.456 --> 01:08:02.786


Everybody starts a web like a blog post like that.01:08:02.786 --> 01:08:03.088


We.01:08:03.088 --> 01:08:06.036


It's an internal like joke in our organization like.01:08:06.135 --> 01:08:07.326


What is it that I have to search for?01:08:07.405 --> 01:08:13.177


like in today's dynamic business environment, or to in today's competitive landscape.01:08:13.338 --> 01:08:32.368


It's always today's ever-evolving business landscape like now we have an 80s organization like have you found using um, you know, chat, gpt or whatever ai tool, your lm tool you're using where you ask it to write something for you?01:08:32.368 --> 01:08:40.125


But consider the seo yep like has that worked well or is it off entirely?01:08:40.265 --> 01:08:41.346


it works, ish.01:08:42.349 --> 01:09:11.179


So again, if you're going to say, I'm gonna do, do my SEO with chat, gpt, with the little agent that someone built in there, like you're going to get 70% of the way there, the same 70% that the other 12 people that also went through that exercise got right and so it can start, it can help, it can give you ideas, it can build out a bit of the structure, but again, if you don't know what you're doing, it's not going to be the end, all and be all of that.01:09:12.564 --> 01:09:17.752


And I mean I think we go back to, like, you know, how do we get found and how does my website come up and how does this happen?01:09:17.752 --> 01:09:29.260


Like the base of that is not just your foundational messaging about who you are, it's your digital architecture and how all of that stuff was constructed in the first place, and how all of that stuff was constructed in the first place.01:09:29.260 --> 01:09:40.712


There's no, to our knowledge, there's no amount of AI that is available right now that could replace somebody who has that as a background, who could come in and do that in a way that we would say would be successful.01:09:40.712 --> 01:09:45.752


It's an augmentation, but it's not going to be a replacement right now.01:09:45.752 --> 01:09:46.695


I mean, who knows right?01:09:46.695 --> 01:09:48.029


Future is what it is.01:09:48.925 --> 01:10:15.091


So you're using AI tool to augment your day-to-days, just to get you a baseline to get you going, because sometimes starting is difficult for many, and so using AI to kind of get you started and then be able to get the ball rolling and I think it improves efficiency so that you can focus more on the creative side now that it's built something for you as a starting point.01:10:17.037 --> 01:10:21.710


Yeah, and you know, I listened to a really interesting podcast actually just about three days ago.01:10:21.850 --> 01:10:22.252


About this.01:10:22.252 --> 01:10:22.552


Is it us?01:10:23.587 --> 01:10:51.747


About this about this yeah, it focused a little bit more on the role AI plays in education, so I won't go down that rabbit hole, because that's right, a topic in and of itself, but the conclusion of it, I think, is, uh, very relevant here, which is we really should not have prompt engineers running our organizations, or any parts of our organizations, through AI.01:10:52.547 --> 01:10:57.155


We need art directors to run art through AI.01:10:57.155 --> 01:11:06.274


We need real digital architects who know how to do this from the ground up, running the SEO and those components through AI.01:11:06.274 --> 01:11:19.889


We need copywriters who know their own voice, who have, you know, harnessed that piece of the art for them to be running the AI that helps them build this, if that makes sense.01:11:19.889 --> 01:11:31.572


So we really do need the skills behind it to run it so it's successful and it doesn't just all turn out the same or because then it's completely ineffective, right and and.01:11:31.572 --> 01:11:46.315


So I just think that that was just a really good conclusion to that, but it just shouldn't be a bunch of prompt engineers that know how to ask these generic questions, because the output will all of a sudden start to, cyclical, be pretty much the same very valid point.01:11:46.337 --> 01:11:51.872


You need to have the right people in the right position doing the right thing, because it's also the same you have some.01:11:51.872 --> 01:11:58.115


Just because somebody can do something doesn't mean they should, or doesn't mean they're good at doing something else.01:11:58.115 --> 01:12:02.434


You could be a great technical person who can build the space shuttle.01:12:02.434 --> 01:12:06.572


It doesn't mean you can run a business selling space shuttles right.01:12:06.572 --> 01:12:08.337


You need to have the right person in the right role.01:12:08.337 --> 01:12:15.819


A couple of few an additional thought before we wind down here, taking up all the valuable time.01:12:15.819 --> 01:12:20.537


I could talk with the two of you all night long, and we'll probably have to have a conversation.01:12:22.127 --> 01:12:23.472


Yes, that's what I was just about to say.01:12:24.527 --> 01:12:29.966


We'll be ready in Vegas to have many, many conversations, some impromptu, some will be coordinated.01:12:29.966 --> 01:12:49.417


But we've talked a lot about marketing across jeez, across many different areas, with ai, with uh, where do you market, how do you market timing and such, and you work with many different customers and many different irsvs within dynamics, three, 65, stack or space.01:12:49.417 --> 01:13:03.516


What are some of the biggest myths I guess you could call them myths that you hear from customers or that you see in the space about marketing for ERP software?01:13:03.516 --> 01:13:06.673


We again, we talked about what's differentiate you or ISVs.01:13:06.673 --> 01:13:12.078


What are some of the myths that some people come to you, um, that you hear that aren't so valid?01:13:14.447 --> 01:13:23.353


I mean, I think the like the thing that we run up against the most often is is just the amount of your revenue that you should contribute back to your marketing engine.01:13:23.353 --> 01:13:32.698


People really do think that marketing can be a discipline that's off the side of someone's desk, or we can just throw this little bit at it, and they don't.01:13:32.698 --> 01:13:41.524


I think a lot of organizations struggle to understand the entire value and sort of input that marketing has on an operation.01:13:41.524 --> 01:13:45.537


It's not just your campaign, it's your brand awareness, it's your employment branding.01:13:45.537 --> 01:13:47.269


Does somebody even want to work for you?01:13:47.269 --> 01:13:51.551


If you're looking for people who are great in the space, what does your company say about you?01:13:51.765 --> 01:13:53.432


All of that ties back to marketing.01:13:53.432 --> 01:13:55.311


What are your customer success stories?01:13:55.311 --> 01:13:57.072


What are those ratings that you're getting?01:13:57.072 --> 01:13:59.024


None of that is easy to obtain.01:13:59.024 --> 01:14:15.609


It takes a lot of people, a lot of work to build those things up, and so assuming that marketing can be run as sort of an off the side of the desk function or sort of like a oh, we have a marketing coordinator, that is all we need is, I think, one of the biggest.01:14:15.609 --> 01:14:35.823


I don't know if that's a myth or how you would call that, but I think that would be one of the things we run into like most often yeah, he's still mine, but I I see, that's what you get for having her go first all the time we must see it a lot, uh, but I think the product of that right brandy is is to your point.01:14:35.844 --> 01:14:46.899


there they're hiring or employing like a single generalist right and thinking that that is all the marketing output that they need.01:14:46.899 --> 01:14:57.377


That Joe or Susie can do graphic design, seo, build a website, do content, run LinkedIn and that's perfect.01:14:57.377 --> 01:15:08.291


That's all we need, and then wondering why they're not making more headway on lead generation or brand awareness in the market and that sort of thing.01:15:08.291 --> 01:15:22.100


There really are specific people that know parts of that work right, and you really do need, for instance, somebody that does graphics very well.01:15:22.100 --> 01:15:25.103


Maybe you have senior and junior.01:15:25.103 --> 01:15:32.979


You need somebody that knows overall strategy and organization.01:15:32.979 --> 01:15:41.845


And, yes, marketing coordinators can play a great role administratively, especially when it comes to events and putting pieces together or connecting parts of the department.01:15:41.845 --> 01:15:44.073


But there really is no unicorn out there.01:15:44.073 --> 01:15:50.626


I just want everybody to know that Nobody can do absolutely every piece of the puzzle.01:15:50.626 --> 01:15:58.659


Well, um, and and we've run up against that an awful lot- that's a great tips to have.01:15:59.667 --> 01:16:00.009


Brandy.01:16:00.009 --> 01:16:04.184


Tara, I did want to go through an exercise with you, but I don't think we have time.01:16:04.184 --> 01:16:07.613


Hopefully we can do it in the future, unless you have time, because I know, a pod.01:16:07.632 --> 01:16:15.113


You should do it for our website we're ready oh, okay should Navi join us for this?01:16:15.375 --> 01:16:15.916


who's Navi?01:16:17.828 --> 01:16:19.734


wait, you name your dog Navi.01:16:19.734 --> 01:16:21.289


No, navi is.01:16:23.889 --> 01:16:25.824


Navi is our on-chromosaurus.01:16:25.824 --> 01:16:26.065


Yeah, we're.01:16:26.105 --> 01:16:28.860


Solomon, solomon and Navi is our on-premis for us.01:16:28.900 --> 01:16:35.818


Yeah, we're Solomon is it like a talking stick?01:16:37.748 --> 01:16:39.635


if you don't upgrade to business central.01:16:40.774 --> 01:16:41.622


Navi and.01:16:41.662 --> 01:16:44.594


Solomon on-premis for us.01:16:44.704 --> 01:16:45.851


Oh, I like that well, if we can go through the exercise.01:16:45.851 --> 01:16:47.381


I know these, these guys spread One premise for us.01:16:47.381 --> 01:16:47.783


Yeah, oh, I like that.01:16:47.783 --> 01:16:50.490


Well, if we can go through the exercise.01:16:50.490 --> 01:16:56.591


I know these guys that have a podcast, oh, yeah, have we met them that they need help.01:16:57.746 --> 01:16:59.346


Yeah, and they just put up a new website.01:16:59.849 --> 01:17:00.953


They just put up a new website.01:17:00.953 --> 01:17:01.627


I did not.01:17:01.667 --> 01:17:02.551


Because they thought they could do it.01:17:02.551 --> 01:17:08.431


I didn't know the help that was needed at all we just need progress.01:17:08.512 --> 01:17:12.411


okay, hey, you made progress over perfection, progress over perfection.01:17:12.465 --> 01:17:13.389


We have guest pages.01:17:13.389 --> 01:17:17.712


Now we have a number of things that we didn't have before, so we've progressed.01:17:18.073 --> 01:17:18.434


You did.01:17:19.235 --> 01:17:22.631


It's not perfect and don't say it's not near perfect.01:17:23.005 --> 01:17:24.912


And it's not on non-premise.01:17:24.912 --> 01:17:25.935


I promise you that.01:17:26.706 --> 01:17:34.783


So how did Navi and Solomon help us through this exercise of how we can have better brand awareness and marketing for this podcast?01:17:37.547 --> 01:17:45.256


we're just going shooting out the general question, just how you just you heard my questions before to brandy when she told me they're very linear.01:17:45.636 --> 01:17:48.025


So I know how to talk into a microphone.01:17:48.025 --> 01:17:51.070


Maybe not well, and that's why I use grammarly.01:17:51.070 --> 01:17:56.880


But what do we do make it work?01:17:56.880 --> 01:17:58.807


Do I sound like a customer?01:17:58.807 --> 01:17:58.847


A?01:18:00.649 --> 01:18:01.251


little bit.01:18:01.251 --> 01:18:05.877


Um, I mean, mean, to be fair to you, you have done a great job.01:18:05.877 --> 01:18:08.707


I think just you had to build this base right.01:18:08.707 --> 01:18:10.171


You're starting to get some momentum.01:18:10.171 --> 01:18:11.796


People are looking at your podcast.01:18:11.796 --> 01:18:12.609


They're interested in it.01:18:12.609 --> 01:18:16.587


You're pulling in people from all sorts of areas and disciplines in the space.01:18:16.587 --> 01:18:21.264


You're not just talking to CEOs of large bars and that kind of thing.01:18:21.264 --> 01:18:23.068


You're getting the big perspective.01:18:23.229 --> 01:18:26.034


I mean, this is a time-based exercise.01:18:26.034 --> 01:18:29.609


I think right now is building that brand awareness.01:18:29.609 --> 01:18:39.278


I think doing things like I have my pin up here that Chris gave me at Summit, doing more of those things this podcast is a labor of love for you two.01:18:39.278 --> 01:18:50.525


Obviously, this is time-consuming and it is obviously taking something out of you to do it, and so that is the message that you need to put forward that you really are doing this because it's something that you love to do.01:18:50.525 --> 01:18:51.948


Why are you doing this?01:18:51.948 --> 01:18:52.189


Right?01:18:52.189 --> 01:18:53.592


Let's get really clear on that.01:18:53.592 --> 01:18:54.756


What is the purpose of this?01:18:54.756 --> 01:18:56.988


Is it just because you like to talk to people all day?01:18:56.988 --> 01:19:00.413


It might be, but I suspect there's something else underneath that.01:19:00.413 --> 01:19:04.319


So, I think, continuing to build those relationships that you're building.01:19:04.545 --> 01:19:06.552


I thought you were asking me a question, I was ready to answer.01:19:06.552 --> 01:19:09.664


Sorry, I thought you were asking me a question, I was ready to answer.01:19:09.824 --> 01:19:17.110


We're trying to make best friends, okay, that's the purpose, no it is a labor of love.01:19:17.230 --> 01:19:22.979


As you say, we started off doing the podcast about four years ago and we took a different direction of it.01:19:22.979 --> 01:19:34.095


For me personally, I enjoy talking with various members of the community to hear their stories, to hear what they do, because it is a great community, it's so large but yet so small, even internationally.01:19:34.095 --> 01:19:42.988


So I enjoy this is me personally speaking with many members of the community hearing what they do, hearing how they do, learning their history.01:19:42.988 --> 01:19:54.387


I enjoy the people aspect of it because we're all people every day working to try to be successful with implementations of Business Central across the D365.01:19:54.387 --> 01:19:57.806


I can't even say Business Central because we branched out beyond that, like you had mentioned, brandy.01:19:58.207 --> 01:20:00.753


So that's the passion for me.01:20:00.753 --> 01:20:08.795


Behind it is just letting everybody tell their story, whether they're an ISV that has a product that helps somebody run their business.01:20:08.795 --> 01:20:26.215


Again, it could be competing ISVs even talking with you from a marketing point of view, getting to know you, your people behind a marketing agency that does well with business central, isvs and customers, and maybe someone listening to this can go, oh, we need some marketing or we need some insights and let's speak with Brandy and Tara over at Big Room.01:20:26.215 --> 01:20:35.554


So that's the passion for me is getting the community together, understanding who's in the community and everybody being able to talk about what they have and what they enjoy doing with others.01:20:37.588 --> 01:20:40.516


So mine's slightly different than Brad putting this together.01:20:40.516 --> 01:20:47.251


It's just really getting to know the human side of all the contents put people put out there.01:20:47.251 --> 01:20:55.554


There's incredible content creators that puts out knowledge, right and thought leadership, but who are they you know as human beings and get to know them.01:20:55.554 --> 01:20:58.659


Like I didn't realize this person played an ukulele.01:20:58.659 --> 01:21:02.730


I didn't realize this person rode motorcycles, you know, and something that I can relate to.01:21:02.925 --> 01:21:13.576


And and just getting to know the people behind the persona of what's put out there, and that also includes partners that we you know.01:21:13.576 --> 01:21:19.836


That that's part of the show and I even ISVs, like including the both of you, and just getting to know.01:21:19.836 --> 01:21:33.420


Like I didn't I didn't realize that Tara goes on vacation all the time, and so you know, and I didn't realize Brandy, you and I are practically neighbors, you know things like that.01:21:33.420 --> 01:21:51.673


It was like that's really cool and in just that relationship aspect of it, not just the content, that's what I love about doing this podcast and then when we see each other, it's much more fun because now we don't have to talk about work all the time, we're just catching up and like be friends.01:21:52.234 --> 01:21:52.985


It's true and it's.01:21:52.985 --> 01:21:54.231


You know it is funny, right?01:21:54.231 --> 01:21:58.170


We all get our like, I think, one of the things that's pretty unique about the space.01:21:58.170 --> 01:22:13.869


Granted, I haven't worked outside of the Dynamics channel, but even the competitive people tend to be out there helping each other out right, like we would never hesitate to recommend one of the competitive partner marketing organizations in the space if it was.01:22:13.869 --> 01:22:26.751


If somebody came to us and we didn't have the capacity to help them, or maybe they were looking for something that wasn't necessarily our sweet spot, and I think that's the same for a lot of the partners and the bars and the ISPs.01:22:26.751 --> 01:22:29.159


You're cross competitive, they're all cross competitive, but in a fairly friendly way.01:22:29.159 --> 01:22:46.992


I mean, I know there's obviously, like certain rivalries and that kind of thing, but I think to the degree that you guys can continue to, to use your love of the human story and exploit that angle a little bit more around the community is going to further your ability to get your podcast across mediums.01:22:47.192 --> 01:22:47.935


So how do we do that?01:22:48.604 --> 01:22:50.453


I mean you keep talking like you have been.01:22:50.453 --> 01:22:52.793


But I think there's I mean we're still being recorded.01:22:52.793 --> 01:22:55.784


I think there's ways to talk to people, right.01:22:56.086 --> 01:22:57.391


You said we could do the exercise.01:22:59.389 --> 01:23:10.811


And I don't know because I have never actually we have never gone down the path of looking at what it would take to get a podcast or something like this off the ground or, like you know, more, more proliferated across the market.01:23:10.811 --> 01:23:30.273


If it was me, I would be cozying up to like the board, directions and the dynamics, user communities and seeing if you can't get yourself as like a media contact at some of these events Right and so we talked about that how, brad, because I'm listening.01:23:30.332 --> 01:23:32.953


I'm listening, chris, you see those kinds of things, right.01:23:32.953 --> 01:23:41.006


So how do you transition from being, you know, these two guys that that happen to work together right now and have their podcasts and they're talking to people?01:23:41.006 --> 01:23:43.613


How do you become something more than that?01:23:43.613 --> 01:23:52.230


How do you break outside of um, the concept that maybe you're looking for internal lead gen and so you're just doing thought leadership as a podcast?01:23:52.230 --> 01:23:57.771


Right, like, how do we get around some of that and really focus on putting yourselves out there like you're a community place?01:23:58.654 --> 01:24:07.448


You are going to naturally, or probably have become a hub of knowledge because of the amount of people you take the time to speak to on your podcast and in person.01:24:07.448 --> 01:24:15.756


You're becoming a centralized place of knowledge yourselves because if somebody asks you a question, you've got four years worth of these conversations that you can drag on.01:24:15.756 --> 01:24:18.692


So how do we harness that in more than here?01:24:18.692 --> 01:24:20.176


Watch our podcast episodes.01:24:20.176 --> 01:24:23.045


I can't watch four years of your podcast episodes.01:24:23.045 --> 01:24:27.452


I can email you and say, hey, I was wondering about this, but I suspect you probably talked to somebody.01:24:27.452 --> 01:24:30.345


So how do you get that a little bit more front and center?01:24:30.425 --> 01:24:33.916


Yeah, we have a little corner of dynamics.01:24:36.146 --> 01:24:36.770


And there's a chair.01:24:37.064 --> 01:24:38.110


Your dynamics corner.01:24:38.110 --> 01:24:50.427


I also really like what you said about what you do, a little bit more than what you have written about what you do, because I really love this angle this right.01:24:50.528 --> 01:24:55.350


Here is where we need help, and I told you we need to pull it out Like this is like being in the therapy chair.01:24:55.350 --> 01:24:56.945


I like this, yeah, well.01:24:57.025 --> 01:25:03.712


I mean looking at your website, we could, we could probably help you with that a little bit, but I mean just front and center.01:25:03.712 --> 01:25:10.917


Right, the concept that you're cultivating and humanizing the Microsoft Dynamics 365 community.01:25:10.917 --> 01:25:16.494


Right, and it's not just business central, it's basically the Microsoft business application space.01:25:16.494 --> 01:25:24.167


But I think that is the important part, right, and that's what you're ultimately out to do.01:25:24.167 --> 01:25:34.856


And I believe I mean, based on the number of people I see at events and it's only a fraction of this community there's tens of thousands of people out there interested in this.01:25:34.856 --> 01:25:55.832


They're spending, you know, a majority of their week in this space and so, um, I think humanizing yourselves a little bit more, um, as a part of the brand for this is, is so important because but I'm not sure your websites really don't.01:25:56.113 --> 01:25:56.552


how do we?01:25:56.552 --> 01:25:57.453


How do we do that?01:25:58.034 --> 01:26:08.750


I'm looking for concrete, like you're telling me to do this, but yeah, I mean, I think, just how you know, I'm a, I'm a, get in it and do it.01:26:08.750 --> 01:26:10.475


I can't necessarily do it verbally.01:26:10.524 --> 01:26:16.939


So we'll do some negotiations, we'll give you some advertising space.01:26:17.225 --> 01:26:29.018


You give us a little write up and then we, we can we have a big room shirt we have a vested interest in your success, so we're very happy to talk with you more about it, for sure.01:26:29.018 --> 01:26:34.686


I mean, you know, like I think one of the things we go back to the beginning we're talking about big room and that type of thing.01:26:34.686 --> 01:26:40.260


We're not we are not a a volume play at big room right, we are a.01:26:40.260 --> 01:26:42.484


We are not a volume play at Big Room right, we are like a bespoke.01:26:42.484 --> 01:27:07.350


Like you get a lot of attention from Tara or myself or whomever is running the account, and that means that when we work with people, we work with people that we believe in their product or their vision or who is working with them, and that is what gets us doing this right, because otherwise we could just sort of do the volume play and be like we want 200 partners to pay us this much money to do to cross compete you against each other, like that's not sort of what we do.01:27:07.350 --> 01:27:20.090


And so, again, like we are looking, we are always interested in helping people in the community grow their space and get where they want to go, and what you guys are doing isn't that far outside of marketing.01:27:20.350 --> 01:27:27.359


We would tell people who had robust marketing departments or had the ability to do this kind of thing, to do a podcast like this, you would have.01:27:27.359 --> 01:27:32.475


You know, if you're doing it within an organization, you get some of the leverage from their website and their marketing.01:27:32.475 --> 01:27:33.356


But this is not.01:27:33.356 --> 01:27:34.707


This is marketing.01:27:34.707 --> 01:27:41.938


You're just marketing yourselves and your and your passion for the community, right, and so I think we would.01:27:41.938 --> 01:27:46.394


You know we, like you guys, we would have an interest in seeing you continue to lead right.01:27:46.605 --> 01:27:47.269


Thank you, I appreciate that.01:27:47.269 --> 01:27:47.971


I'm glad you like us.01:27:47.971 --> 01:27:49.851


We want you to love us eventually.01:27:49.851 --> 01:27:51.257


It's quality over quantity.01:27:52.025 --> 01:27:53.583


Well, it's back to Brad and his best friend level with me.01:27:54.188 --> 01:27:55.465


Oh no, we're back to best friend level.01:27:55.465 --> 01:27:58.766


Well, I say with others that I've talked about it for Well, I say with others that I've talked about it.01:27:58.766 --> 01:28:01.548


For me, this passion is the true passion.01:28:01.548 --> 01:28:06.212


I'm the type of person that I'm doing it for that, and once I don't have the passion, I'll be done.01:28:06.212 --> 01:28:07.512


It's just how it is.01:28:07.512 --> 01:28:15.118


It doesn't matter what it turns into, because I enjoy the conversations with every single person that we have, and that's what drives me.01:28:15.319 --> 01:28:17.199


That was the promise that Brad and I had.01:28:17.199 --> 01:28:20.342


Like we cannot make this feel like it's work.01:28:20.342 --> 01:28:22.171


Right, promise that Brad and I had.01:28:22.171 --> 01:28:23.097


We cannot make this feel like it's work.01:28:23.097 --> 01:28:24.627


We have to enjoy it and just love doing it.01:28:24.627 --> 01:28:28.413


The moment it feels like it's work, it's like oh, it's going to be painful.01:28:29.907 --> 01:28:38.170


You have an opportunity when my husband and I if we go to visit Tara and her husband, who also works in the channel we can't help it.01:28:38.170 --> 01:28:47.335


It's so much of the conversation that it isn't even necessarily we're not talking tactical, like we got to do this, we got to do that.01:28:47.335 --> 01:28:54.365


I mean, tara and I are sometimes doing that, but when we're talking, you know, more broadly, it's like you just can't help it.01:28:54.787 --> 01:29:19.617


It's just because we spend so much time doing this and so that is like you guys are like the guy at the kitchen, like table, that would actually talk to me at a party, because I, that is like you guys are like the guy at the kitchen, like table, that would actually talk to me at a party, because I'd be like, oh my god, like this marketing thing and this channel thing and everybody else is just like very glossed over, because it you, we're all here forever and we spend all of our time doing this and we find it very interesting and I think that's just a special group of weirdos that we are right.01:29:19.676 --> 01:29:32.405


Like my husband worked here very briefly over the COVID times and he and he's we've been, you know, he's been around this forever and he was like, okay, well, it took me all of the previous knowing you and then a year of working here.01:29:32.405 --> 01:29:49.136


I think I've maybe figured out like what's going on a little bit in this group, right, because it's not like you can't explain it to people that are outside of the channel and so like you're like everyone's best friend I was told it's like a cult.01:29:49.958 --> 01:29:50.787


We're all in a cult.01:29:50.787 --> 01:29:52.532


We're in a big cult the, the community.01:29:52.532 --> 01:29:55.228


I call it a community, so I guess it makes it sound like a cult.01:29:55.228 --> 01:29:56.069


You call it a channel.01:29:56.069 --> 01:29:57.753


It's uh, it's a cult.01:29:57.753 --> 01:30:00.791


Okay, so we have to humanize ourselves.01:30:00.851 --> 01:30:02.025


I like going through this exercise.01:30:02.065 --> 01:30:14.559


I'm enjoying going through how you're helping a young organization such as a podcast, grow so it's basically we just have to record ourselves brad.01:30:14.578 --> 01:30:16.845


That, uh, that's not like behind the scenes.01:30:16.845 --> 01:30:29.752


You know, we don't brad and I'll try not to talk about work outside of this space sometimes and we just talk about, hey, what did you cook, what did you smoke in your smoker, things like that.01:30:30.815 --> 01:30:33.948


But how do we do that, but how do we get?01:30:33.967 --> 01:30:36.034


that on the website so that it's searchable.01:30:36.034 --> 01:30:37.149


How do we get it to show up?01:30:37.149 --> 01:30:37.932


How do we do this?01:30:37.932 --> 01:30:39.411


This is where I'm stuck.01:30:39.411 --> 01:30:46.690


I could go back to Brandy with my linear thinking how do I get it so that we market?01:30:46.690 --> 01:30:49.472


Well, chris, to your point, we could have those conversations that we have.01:30:49.472 --> 01:30:59.581


So we just record those conversations and just put them up as episodes, without guests, and just stay behind the scenes as just a portion of extending what you're talking about here, right?01:30:59.600 --> 01:31:12.914


because outside of this, if we left this room and we didn't know you two at all, we don't know if you go and leave this and not to talk to each other until another guest comes back, or if you guys regularly hang it like you know, people don't know that no, we don't hang out.01:31:12.914 --> 01:31:15.305


He's in the opposite side of the country.01:31:15.305 --> 01:31:22.163


Well, but sorry, like text messaging or whatever it is right, right right but there is.01:31:22.224 --> 01:31:23.466


You know, there there is ways.01:31:23.466 --> 01:31:29.586


And this is where, like I I am, I don't have tiktok, I can't get there, I'm not going to.01:31:29.586 --> 01:31:32.296


This is where people would be like, oh, you put those things on tiktok.01:31:32.296 --> 01:31:34.407


I think it's better to kind of keep it in.01:31:34.407 --> 01:31:40.488


You know your closed system, but I think you guys could talk a little bit more to each other on linked, for instance.01:31:40.488 --> 01:31:43.015


You guys can do some of these podcasts.01:31:43.015 --> 01:31:45.287


Why don't you interview each other?01:31:45.287 --> 01:31:50.414


Why don't one of you sit on either side of this and just have these conversations in both directions and just see?01:31:50.515 --> 01:31:51.256


Chris, you're taking notes?01:31:51.856 --> 01:31:52.618


I'm taking notes.01:31:53.140 --> 01:31:53.359


Okay.01:31:58.288 --> 01:32:02.414


Theoretically, you're being a little bit more self-promotional.01:32:02.414 --> 01:32:06.220


Which back to your no one wants to write a bio about themselves and all those kinds of things.01:32:06.966 --> 01:32:07.751


I can't do that.01:32:07.751 --> 01:32:12.957


I am one that I could not self-promote anything of myself period.01:32:12.957 --> 01:32:24.667


I can sit and talk to anybody and do anything, but you actually have asked me to sit down and talk about myself or write about myself.01:32:24.667 --> 01:32:25.210


I can't do it.01:32:25.210 --> 01:32:26.213


I get stage fright.01:32:27.627 --> 01:32:28.631


We can help you with that.01:32:31.046 --> 01:32:32.051


It's recorded, by the way.01:32:32.626 --> 01:32:37.310


I also want to know that oftentimes we'll get content from people.01:32:37.612 --> 01:33:04.100


That is like you were saying you drive around and you rant it into your phone and then you have to get grammarly to fix it you oftentimes get just the straight thought, like stream of consciousness rant into someone's phone when they're driving around, and then we have to make it into something like there are ways to get the content to a place where it can be publicly shareable, while still honoring your issues with talking about yourself or your inability to write or your disinterest in sitting down in front of a computer and doing it.01:33:04.140 --> 01:33:18.408


It's just about thinking about different ways to do that right yeah, we could definitely take a look in the under the hood of that, that website there I mean a few title tags, a long way uh say the game please the few title tags like you can.01:33:18.529 --> 01:33:25.216


The seo strategy could be probably touched even microscopically on that site, like there are things to do with that.01:33:25.216 --> 01:33:27.104


But back to tara's earlier point.01:33:27.104 --> 01:33:34.217


What is the goal of being found like what, what, what do you get out of this podcast?01:33:34.217 --> 01:33:34.639


What do you?01:33:34.925 --> 01:33:36.527


I get enjoying again.01:33:36.527 --> 01:33:38.229


Not to the chris, you can go first.01:33:38.229 --> 01:33:39.612


Forget it, you go first next time.01:33:39.612 --> 01:33:48.243


My goal is to talk with as many people and even have repeat conversations, follow-up conversations.01:33:48.243 --> 01:33:49.784


We're going to cycle I don't want to say cycle.01:33:49.784 --> 01:34:03.167


We're going to have a number of individuals come back on again as sort of a follow-up, because we may have talked to them a year ago, two years ago, just to talk to them about where they've progressed in their lives, in their careers or in what they're doing.01:34:03.167 --> 01:34:12.596


My goal is to talk to as many people in the community as possible, so that is why you want to be found, so that more people will want to speak with you.01:34:14.485 --> 01:34:24.260


In essence, I think it's more people want to speak with us so we can have the conversations about the different things that you can do within this space.01:34:24.260 --> 01:34:27.395


Again, it could be an ISV that offers us a product.01:34:27.395 --> 01:34:29.412


It can be consultants that offer services.01:34:29.412 --> 01:34:31.393


It could be customers that are using the product.01:34:31.393 --> 01:34:41.020


So we want anybody that's within this space to be able to talk with them about themselves, their lives and the technology.01:34:41.020 --> 01:34:42.729


So how do you use Business Central?01:34:42.729 --> 01:34:43.432


How has it helped you?01:34:43.432 --> 01:34:46.795


What are the services that you may be able to provide someone to help them?01:34:46.795 --> 01:34:48.551


What is the product that you have that can help them?01:34:48.551 --> 01:34:50.712


Is that too broad for me to say that I want to talk?01:34:50.712 --> 01:34:52.886


When I say I want to talk with everybody, but that's kind of.01:34:52.886 --> 01:35:00.814


The target that we're looking for is to be able to talk with individuals across the different roles.01:35:00.814 --> 01:35:05.270


So you have very similar like wait, hold on.01:35:05.390 --> 01:35:05.832


I want to know what.01:35:05.832 --> 01:35:06.131


Tara.01:35:06.131 --> 01:35:07.055


Tara, you had something to say.01:35:07.114 --> 01:35:26.606


Spit it, I could see it's okay, it's still being recorded, but I would, if we were off air, perhaps ask you if you think this is more valuable for professionals that do work in this industry on a day-to-day basis.01:35:26.606 --> 01:35:29.292


Then potentially like so.01:35:29.292 --> 01:35:32.305


For instance, I'll just go with my husband's industry.01:35:32.305 --> 01:35:35.074


He delivers a business central to wineries, right.01:35:35.074 --> 01:35:45.458


In the end, the people he works with are really mostly concerned about where their wine is going, what their distribution is, who's drinking it and and that.01:35:45.458 --> 01:35:49.716


Right, they're not as concerned with business central all the time.01:35:49.716 --> 01:35:54.291


Yes, it could be a core part of the CFOs or the inventory manager's job.01:35:54.291 --> 01:36:07.698


Ask you, do you think your target audience, or maybe who you're cultivating this community for, is more geared to the tens of thousands of professionals that work within this space?01:36:08.145 --> 01:36:10.975


Yes, because of the conversations we have.01:36:10.975 --> 01:36:36.635


I hope that somebody and when we do the pre-podcast calls with everybody, we hope that the conversation I say what I say to everybody in the pre-podcast calls we want to have a relatable conversation and hopefully something that somebody can get something out of, because those individuals in this space I hope they learn something from it Whether it could be if a customer, if we're speaking with a customer, a customer can say how they're using Business Central, some of the challenges they have, so that maybe another ISV it's just, in a sense, it's bringing everybody together.01:36:36.635 --> 01:36:37.996


See, now I'm getting passionate, I don't know if you can tell.01:36:37.996 --> 01:36:45.081


It's how you can bring everybody together to be successful, whatever that success is for them, because rising tides raise all ships.01:36:45.081 --> 01:36:51.756


I say it over and over again If Business Central and this channel, this cult or this community is successful, everybody in it is also successful.01:36:51.796 --> 01:37:07.787


So if we can have a place where people can come talk freely, share information that somebody else may be able to listen to and get something from it, again it can be an isv, because they may have a solution that somebody can use to make their implementation easier.01:37:07.787 --> 01:37:27.337


Or a partner can help with a customer or customers say, hey, this is there, even in an agency such as yours, the boutique marketing agency that if they need some help publicizing the isv or getting some more traction with their business central or Dynamics 365 implementation team or even a customer may have products that they want to sell.01:37:27.337 --> 01:37:36.297


I know you target primarily the partners and the ISVs, but even some of the tips and tricks that we talked about here to me, I think could be applied to any business of how to become more successful.01:37:36.297 --> 01:37:40.516


So that's my steadfast goal is to have a knowledge share.01:37:41.064 --> 01:37:43.311


It's very similar Mine's very, very similar to Brad.01:37:43.372 --> 01:37:59.003


It's just a volume of people who want to talk to from different industries and even, if I can, I can even extend beyond that where you know, when I first started my career, it was very difficult to find content, very difficult to find people to you know, bounce ideas and things like that.01:37:59.024 --> 01:38:26.645


Maybe you have some local user groups and such, but it was always been limited to the regional area, and so what I'm trying to get out of this podcast is to be able to reach out globally where people can feel like, hey, I know I can listen to this podcast and I'm learning maybe someone that's changing careers or maybe kind of learning the industry or maybe trying to get into this industry and getting information from that aspect.01:38:26.824 --> 01:38:49.622


And so if I can help in that capacity to get more people into this community, it's like our cult to get them to be part of this, the things that we're working on, the things that we're working on, that's perfect, because then it kind of reminds me, reminded me of myself, where I wish this existed when I was building my career, because it would have, it would have accelerated.01:38:49.622 --> 01:39:06.956


Now I get to know the ISVs out there that I should be paying attention, or the tools that is solving problems and and instead of like Googling at that time and maybe only see the first five, now I can go to this podcast and maybe I'm searching for something and it's.01:39:06.956 --> 01:39:14.055


You know, maybe we had a conversation solving a problem from different perspective and not just reading a content that someone put out.01:39:15.606 --> 01:39:22.072


So this types of conversation, these exercises you go through with individuals that you work with, I like the way that you're pulling this out to be honest with you.01:39:22.172 --> 01:39:22.795


I'm just saying it.01:39:23.926 --> 01:39:26.818


I appreciate the opportunity to talk about the passion of it.01:39:27.560 --> 01:39:29.944


Yeah, and I mean it is part of what we go through.01:39:29.944 --> 01:39:34.856


And again, sometimes customers get really into it and they want to go down this path.01:39:34.856 --> 01:39:39.595


And sometimes they think we're trying to run a meter and just talk.01:39:39.595 --> 01:39:40.137


You know what I mean.01:39:40.137 --> 01:39:44.113


And it's like, well, really like we're only as successful as the story that we can tell.01:39:44.113 --> 01:39:49.199


And sometimes that is a point at which we decide that we're not a fit for a certain organization.01:39:49.199 --> 01:39:52.971


Right, because some organizations are like I have lots of money to pour into paid media.01:39:52.971 --> 01:39:55.356


I just want someone to run that for us.01:39:55.356 --> 01:40:00.377


You can do it that way and that's fine, but that just isn't going.01:40:00.377 --> 01:40:03.364


It doesn't go very well with our business process.01:40:03.564 --> 01:40:20.840


We do like to have these conversations, we like to make people think about it in a different way and just like anybody's sort of craft right, like we forget that things that we know or that we might, off the cuff, suggest you do isn't something that you would come up with on your own in a million years, just because you wouldn't even think about it.01:40:20.840 --> 01:40:44.100


Or I'm always like, well, it's like obvious, but it it isn't obvious to people, and so you do need to have the conversations, like having that context, that what you're really looking for out of this, beyond building this knowledge base, is to try to get more diverse people to come onto your podcast, is a really big differentiator in terms of when you say you want to be found, it's a lot easier.01:40:44.100 --> 01:40:47.033


Like you, everybody in this industry will talk to you.01:40:47.033 --> 01:40:47.916


They all want to talk.01:40:47.916 --> 01:40:49.811


You run into them at conferences.01:40:49.811 --> 01:40:53.015


They can't stop talking about their product themselves or company, their thing.01:40:53.015 --> 01:40:56.095


Right, you just have to get in front of them and offer them the opportunity.01:40:57.666 --> 01:41:08.819


And I would say like from my perspective and I won't speak for Tara like it would never have occurred to me that you would have wanted to talk to us on this podcast until I think you and I had like a bit of a conversation.01:41:08.819 --> 01:41:10.627


I kind of made a joke like, oh, are you gonna have us on the podcast?01:41:10.627 --> 01:41:28.011


When you said whenever you want, I was like oh, I didn't actually think that we would be somebody that you would want on here, and not because there's anything like I, just I was envisioning it really like you wanted more technical information or you wanted to talk a lot more with people who work with the product or those kinds of things.01:41:28.011 --> 01:41:31.930


So I mean, just be unashamed about what you're trying to do.01:41:32.827 --> 01:41:36.164


Tell people, hey, do you know somebody that you think would be cool on my podcast?01:41:36.164 --> 01:41:45.395


Like, hook me up and then I'll take you for a coffee or we'll, you know, give you some accolades or say thank you on LinkedIn that you introduced us.01:41:45.395 --> 01:41:45.577


Like.01:41:45.577 --> 01:41:57.418


People are motivated, especially in this space, like about that little bits of recognition, about being part of something right, because otherwise we're all just this cog in this big machine that Microsoft owns.01:41:57.418 --> 01:42:03.867


So giving people the opportunity to stake their claim is more powerful than you might be thinking about it probably Boom.01:42:03.987 --> 01:42:04.690


This is great.01:42:07.668 --> 01:42:10.753


This is a referral program or something?01:42:10.753 --> 01:42:12.730


Here we are.01:42:13.131 --> 01:42:18.247


We started off a little rough, but I think we're going to be BFFs by the time this is over.01:42:18.368 --> 01:42:20.429


Okay, now we're acronyming it, we're going to get the tattoos.01:42:20.429 --> 01:42:20.932


Don't time this is over.01:42:20.932 --> 01:42:22.161


Okay, now we're acronyming it, we're going to get the tattoos.01:42:22.161 --> 01:42:22.744


Don't get this Vegas man.01:42:23.985 --> 01:42:24.587


Don't get too.01:42:24.587 --> 01:42:26.774


There are no more tattoos going on this body.01:42:26.774 --> 01:42:30.164


I would get one more, but now I think I'm too old for it, so I'm not getting any more.01:42:30.365 --> 01:42:32.850


See, I figure the older you get, the less it matters.01:42:32.850 --> 01:42:34.987


I don't know because.01:42:35.106 --> 01:42:36.430


Yeah, yeah, what you going for now?01:42:36.430 --> 01:42:36.670


Well, it's.01:42:43.332 --> 01:42:46.970


Yeah, well, I think it's just a matter of where and what.01:42:46.970 --> 01:42:55.753


I think I made sure that mine could be covered completely if needed, but anyway, we digress, okay.01:42:55.753 --> 01:42:57.368


So, chris, we need to talk to each other more.01:42:57.368 --> 01:42:58.653


That might be a struggle.01:42:58.653 --> 01:42:59.536


We'll have to work on that.01:42:59.536 --> 01:43:06.759


We need to come up with some branding to talk about what we're trying to do with the podcast as far as bringing people together.01:43:06.759 --> 01:43:08.551


It's not necessarily branded to your point.01:43:08.551 --> 01:43:09.689


Thank you, see.01:43:09.689 --> 01:43:10.984


This is good you pulled it out.01:43:11.164 --> 01:43:15.716


By the way, for the record, Brandon and I talk a lot right outside of this.01:43:15.716 --> 01:43:16.907


We just have to record it.01:43:16.907 --> 01:43:18.972


Brad, that's the problem.01:43:18.972 --> 01:43:20.216


We could be anywhere right now.01:43:20.216 --> 01:43:22.220


We just be like, we'll just record this right now.01:43:22.240 --> 01:43:25.177


You could be smoking your Some of those conversations I don't think we want to record.01:43:25.238 --> 01:43:31.365


to be honest with you, you don't even have to necessarily record the conversation, throw a selfie up there or be like Brad and I were having.01:43:31.365 --> 01:43:41.055


I mean, just you know, I think I probably, like I was way too into the Twitter era so I got used to very like everything was a quip.01:43:41.055 --> 01:43:42.756


What can I throw out there?01:43:42.756 --> 01:43:46.099


Right, and that's just like where my brain goes with this kind of stuff.01:43:46.099 --> 01:43:48.881


It's just like that is the easy part.01:43:48.881 --> 01:43:53.068


You're not selling FNSEM or whatever it's called today.01:43:53.068 --> 01:43:53.670


Like this is you guys.01:43:53.670 --> 01:43:55.854


Are just you just trying to get people to talk about themselves?01:43:56.957 --> 01:43:57.297


Perfect.01:43:57.297 --> 01:44:01.614


So we'll do the next conference that we'll all get to see each other.01:44:01.614 --> 01:44:06.095


There'll be off-the-cuff conversation, yep, in person.01:44:06.095 --> 01:44:09.627


So, for example, the directions, I think we're all gonna see each other.01:44:10.568 --> 01:44:13.734


So you guys will be there, we will be the las vegas.01:44:13.755 --> 01:44:20.211


We'll be there vegas is big, we may not see each other.01:44:20.211 --> 01:44:21.233


I've gone to conferences.01:44:21.233 --> 01:44:36.807


I have never been to a conference and not seen you too, so I think I went to some conferences recently last summit we we didn't see a bunch of people and I I swear I didn't know that people were there, was it in?01:44:36.828 --> 01:44:37.630


san antonio, was it?01:44:37.670 --> 01:44:49.850


yes, it was san antonio where there were a lot of people that I normally see at these conferences or events that I didn't run into at all, and then I talked with them afterwards and they were there.01:44:49.850 --> 01:44:51.738


It was just weird for some reason.01:44:51.759 --> 01:45:06.095


So some it's a different beast in all of their like individual parties and that kind of thing I mean directions is a little bit more oh, you'll see us at directions, you're right directions is partner, partner focused so it's a01:45:07.337 --> 01:45:20.436


different type of we are always everywhere, so you I think it's a great place for us to continue the conversation about articulating your brand here getting you out there more okay perfect.01:45:20.436 --> 01:45:31.296


All right, I think that's the next step I think you got to let everybody know you're here to cultivate the community grammarly won't write that for me, so I'm gonna send you some questions.01:45:31.417 --> 01:45:37.134


You can think, have a conversation that'll be excellent, I appreciate.01:45:37.194 --> 01:45:38.855


Okay, so we started the exercise.01:45:38.855 --> 01:45:42.347


We will finish the exercise, just this.01:45:42.347 --> 01:45:47.886


I think we have spent about 15 minutes, looking at the time, or maybe a little more than 15 minutes.01:45:47.886 --> 01:45:57.054


Again, it's a blur for me, and just what we spoke about in those 15 minutes totally changed my view of how to get the message out.01:45:57.054 --> 01:45:58.796


I don't know how to do it.01:45:58.796 --> 01:46:06.313


I know what we need to do, not the how, and also it gave me an interesting perspective of what we're doing, fantastic.01:46:06.313 --> 01:46:07.194


So I appreciate that.01:46:07.213 --> 01:46:08.456


That's what we're here for.01:46:08.475 --> 01:46:09.658


No, I think that was.01:46:09.658 --> 01:46:15.457


I think I think it was enlightening for me to go through that brief exercise personally.01:46:15.585 --> 01:46:17.833


Did you say we made progress today, Brad?01:46:18.626 --> 01:46:20.510


We made progress, but we didn't make perfection.01:46:20.510 --> 01:46:23.595


Yes, brandy's now a friend.01:46:24.037 --> 01:46:25.265


Here we go Perfect.01:46:26.668 --> 01:46:26.970


That's good.01:46:26.970 --> 01:46:30.136


Well, brandy Tara, thank you very much for taking the time to speak with us today.01:46:30.136 --> 01:46:32.006


We greatly appreciate it.01:46:32.006 --> 01:46:38.717


I learned a lot from it and I feel energized about marketing the podcast.01:46:39.059 --> 01:46:39.259


Awesome.01:46:39.765 --> 01:46:41.470


I appreciate what you've done with us.01:46:41.470 --> 01:46:54.706


If anyone's interested in learning a little bit more about Big Room or talking with you about some of the opportunities or services or help that you can provide for partners, ISVs or within the dynamic space, how can they get in contact with you?01:46:55.606 --> 01:47:05.815


We are both on LinkedIn, or our first names at bigroomcreativecom are our email addresses, and, or you will find us at the conferences.01:47:05.815 --> 01:47:09.992


We will be at directions in all of our swag for different customers.01:47:12.957 --> 01:47:13.738


Excellent, excellent.01:47:13.738 --> 01:47:15.230


Again, thank you very much.01:47:15.230 --> 01:47:18.594


We appreciate your time and we look forward to seeing you in Vegas.01:47:18.634 --> 01:47:19.396


You will Awesome.01:47:19.396 --> 01:47:21.287


Talk to you soon, ciao, ciao, thanks.01:47:21.328 --> 01:47:24.113


Chris, thanks, bye, bye.01:47:24.913 --> 01:47:31.996


Thank you, chris, for your time for another episode of In the Dynamics Corner Chair, and thank you to our guests for participating.01:47:32.324 --> 01:47:33.850


Thank you, brad, for your time.01:47:33.850 --> 01:47:37.362


It is a wonderful episode of Dynamics Corner Chair.01:47:37.362 --> 01:47:40.811


I would also like to thank our guests for joining us.01:47:40.811 --> 01:47:43.847


Thank you for all of our listeners tuning in as well.01:47:43.847 --> 01:47:58.431


You can find Brad at developerlifecom, that is D-V-L-P-R-L-I-F-E dot com, and you can interact with them via Twitter D-V-L-P-R-L-I-F-E.01:47:58.431 --> 01:48:11.752


You can also find me at matalinoio, m-a-t-a-l-i-n-o dot I-O, and my Twitter handle is matalino16.01:48:11.752 --> 01:48:15.399


And you can see those links down below in the show notes.01:48:15.399 --> 01:48:16.765


Again, thank you everyone.01:48:16.765 --> 01:48:18.307


Thank you and take care.